Adventist Online

The SDA 28 Fundamentals has IJ as one of those pillars that upholds the platform we stand on. To my surprise I have noted some of the saints around here do not think there is any Investigative Judgement. So let us see if there is a Investigative Judgement or not. I have also noted that the same Saints do not subscribe to the writings of E G White. So I would prefer that we use the Bible only.

The SDA church does have the Investigative Judgement as one of its 28 fundamentals Quoting:

24. Christ's Ministry in the Heavenly Sanctuary:

There is a sanctuary in heaven, the true tabernacle which the Lord set up and not man. In it Christ ministers on our behalf, making available to believers the benefits of His atoning sacrifice offered once for all on the cross. He was inaugurated as our great High Priest and began His intercessory ministry at the time of His ascension. In 1844, at the end of the prophetic period of 2300 days, He entered the second and last phase of His atoning ministry. It is a work of investigative judgment which is part of the ultimate disposition of all sin, typified by the cleansing of the ancient Hebrew sanctuary on the Day of Atonement. In that typical service the sanctuary was cleansed with the blood of animal sacrifices, but the heavenly things are purified with the perfect sacrifice of the blood of Jesus. The investigative judgment reveals to heavenly intelligences who among the dead are asleep in Christ and therefore, in Him, are deemed worthy to have part in the first resurrection. It also makes manifest who among the living are abiding in Christ, keeping the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus, and in Him, therefore, are ready for translation into His everlasting kingdom. This judgment vindicates the justice of God in saving those who believe in Jesus. It declares that those who have remained loyal to God shall receive the kingdom. The completion of this ministry of Christ will mark the close of human probation before the Second Advent. (Heb. 8:1-5; 4:14-16; 9:11-28; 10:19-22; 1:3; 2:16, 17; Dan. 7:9-27; 8:13, 14; 9:24-27; Num. 14:34; Eze. 4:6; Lev. 16; Rev. 14:6, 7; 20:12; 14:12; 22:12.)

28 fundamental Beliefs sdanet.org

The hour of the evening sacrifice arrives. The priest stands in the court of the Temple in Jerusalem ready to offer a lamb as sacrifice. As he raises the knife to kill the victim, the earth convulses. Terrified, he drops the knife and the lamb escapes. Over the din of the earthquake he hears a loud ripping noise as an unseen hand rends the veil of the Temple from top to bottom. What did the tearing of the veil really mean?

Across town, black clouds enshroud a cross. When Jesus, the Passover Lamb of God, calls out, "It is finished!" He dies for the sins of the world.

Type has met antitype. The very event the Temple services have pointed to through the centuries has taken place. The Saviour has completed His atoning sacrifice, and because symbol has met reality, the rituals foreshadowing this sacrifice have been superseded. Thus the rent veil, the dropped knife, the escaped lamb.

But there is more to salvation history. It reaches beyond the cross. Jesus' resurrection and ascension direct our attention to the heavenly sanctuary, where, no longer the Lamb, He ministers as priest. The once-for-all sacrifice has been offered (Heb. 9:28); now He makes available to all the benefits of this atoning sacrifice.

I have noted some of the saints here saying that the atonement was fulfilled on the cross. I wonder how this could be correct? We have many texts telling us that there is an ongoing Investigative Judgement happening in the heavenly courts at this very moment.

Views: 5581

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

There are many parables on the investigative judgement...

but this Bible text is the most prudent

1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

It concerns the end of time, God always judges His own first and the wicked are not judged until the end of the world, or if their sinning is so bad that is prevents others from making a choice decision for God....

Shalom

Thanks Brother Rob for your post, Yes it's a good text it shows us it must be after the Cross and before Christs return.

Your remark about preventing others from making their choice is to the point. My thoughts goes to the middle east and what is happening there in particular.

In the desert the Israel believers had investigative judgements every Day of Atonement....Why was this ? And what did it signify ?

Why did the sanctuary require cleansing every year ? It helps me to understand our standing before GOD is continually being judged .... Do we truly believe we are saved daily ? That tells me we are judged daily ...

What does judge mean anyway? Does it not mean God comes to us to see how we are getting on in a relationship with Him ?

Da 3:25 He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God.

Is this not a investigating judgement on three worthies?

Some say when I confess my sinning in the beginning of my life, Jesus on the Cross accepts me, and I am saved....saved as a SEED maybe, but hardly the end of your salvation, only the beginning....how can you be saved if there is no fruit, the evidence of Jesus salvation in you wrought to His good pleasure?

A seed cannot save you unless the seed brings forth its fruit....

The fastest seed to fruit / alpha / omega/ beginning to end salvation experience is the thief on the Cross...

He took the SEED (Jesus) and salvation began in Him, Than he confessed and spoke fruits from His lips that confess HIs Name to others....The fruit from that SEED germinated and made fruit very quickly...

Was He salvation experience judge by Jesus ? Yes indeed, for Jesus promised Him a reward both that very hour and for eternity....Paradise is both a Person and a Place, and Jesus gave Him all....

Personally I find investigating judgements help the believer to know He is in love with Jesus, otherwise if we are not judged how would we know...the Israel people knew every Day of Atonement, they were truly saved for that year....

So why doesn't our SDA people solemnly think about Jesus investigating us ? Maybe we have no gardens He would be pleased to visit?  Perhaps we should be spending time reflecting the lovely face of Jesus.

Shalom

 

Amen Brother Rob thank you very much for your post

The Day of Atonement was not a day of judgment, it was the day of At-OneMent. The God of Love provided a day of apology, reparation to the people to amend and atone for sins through our High Priest. Leviticus 16:30 says,

…because on this day atonement will be made for you, to cleanse you. Then, before the Lord, you will be clean from all your sins.

On this day Aaron will make peace with the LORD to make you clean. Then you will be clean from all your sins in the LORD's presence.

…for on that day he shall reconcile you to cleanse you that ye may be clean from all your sins before the LORD.

LOVE (God) is ALWAYS working on behalf of humanity to put them in right standing with SOURCE (God).

2 Corinthians 5:19 says, …For God was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself, no longer counting people's sins against them.

Thank you Gene a great contribution

Rob,

I don't think anyone has a problem with the judgment. We all know that Christ has been at the right hand of the Father since He ascended after the cross.

Isa. 53 tells us Christ bore  the sins of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

The problem is still the 2300 days and the setting of the date 1844. I traveled with an evangelist team for a number of years, and taught the 2300 days and the IJ. No matter how you cut it, there is no biblical way to establish the starting date  for the 2300 days.

William was the spirit of prophecy who preached the date 1844. He was a Baptist preacher, but never accepted the Sabbath. Yet he is saved.

.Hiram Edison was the spirit of prophecy that was given a vision in a corn field telling of the IJ.

Uriah Smith was influential in establishing teachings on Daniel and Revelation which we have taught in our schools for years.

All these men were sincere honest men who were following  the directions of God and the prophetic spirit of God.

God gave a very exact starting date for the seventy weeks. Why did He not do the same for the 2300 days?

Christ is with the Father in the heavenly sanctuary as we speak. The fact that he is there is not the foundation of our church. The fact He died for us, makes Him the foundation of our beliefs.

Keith

Peace,



Brother Keith, once again you can't get around that the 2300 days spoken of in Dan.8 is being explained in Dan.9.... As a matter fact you already agreed with me.


I asked,


Reasoning "One more time, the point is, you can't excluded the 2300 evening and morning in chapter 8 from what's being explained by Gabriel to Daniel in Chapter 9. That was something Daniel didn't understand. Can we agree?"


and you answered,


Keith: " I agree with what are saying, is there someway you can agree to individual questions on this site, all I see is reply, to the entire statement."


So Keith, you say

Keith "No matter how you cut it, there is no biblical way to establish the starting date for the 2300 days."...


I don't know how you figure that, when you already agree the 2300 days is being explained in Dan.9 in another post... you just drop out of our study, then come on this post and bring up the same weak points.


Here it goes again Keith,



Dan.8:22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.
23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.



Understanding on what Keith?



It must be what was spoken of in Dan.8 and the visions Daniel didn't understand, with the 2300 days being one of them. The connection is there, the "overlap" is there.. Gabriel words confirms it. So you can't say the 2300 days doesn't play a part of what's being explained in Dan.9, because Gabriel came back to give Daniel understanding on things he didn't understand in Dan.8, and again, the 2300 days(evening and morning) was one of those visions Daniel didn't understand.


(ESV) Dan.8:26 The vision of the evenings and the mornings that has been told is true, but seal up the vision, for it refers to many days from now.”
27 And I, Daniel, was overcome and lay sick for some days. Then I rose and went about the king's business, but I was appalled by the vision and did not understand it.



See, lets the Bible speak for itself, Daniel didn't understand the evenings and mornings vision, why? because it was sealed up when Gabriel came the first time and wasn't explained.


What evenings and mornings can it be talking about Keith?


The only place to find "evenings and mornings" in that chapter is in verse 14.


(ESV) Dan.8:14 And he said to me,“For 2,300 evenings and mornings. Then the sanctuary shall be restored to its rightful state.”


Thank GOD by HIS Grace and heavy praying from Daniel, Gabriel came back years later to reveal the 2300 days(evenings & mornings)(Dan.9).


Can you agree with clear Bible Truth Keith?



Blessings!

Reasoning,

I'm sorry I gave the wrong impression. I was agreeing with another statement and replied incorrectly.

The point I'm trying to make is, seventy weeks are determined..... cut off..... cut off from what? Ok the 2300 days. That's fine. However, supposing it is cut off from the end of the 2300 days? Then we have an altogether different time line.

Even if we translate the word " determined" to mean cut off it really doesn't say when. Do you see what I'm saying?

Then suppose the 2300 day prophecy was fulfilled with Antiochus? And the seventy weeks were decreed instead of cut off.

These are questions that come up when dealing with non Adventist, once again the bottom line is, we can't prove biblically the starting point of the 2300 days.

I didn't say I don't believe the 2300 day prophecy, All I said is we SDA's can't prove it biblically. That when you need to believe the SOP without doubt.

Remember the Mormons believe the 2300 days was fulfilled in 1844 in their church, proving they are the true church.

Keith

Peace,



Here it goes again Keith, you and Herbert seem to want to over look clear Bible Truth...



Dan.9:22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.
23 At the beginning of thy supplications the commandment came forth, and I am come to shew thee; for thou art greatly beloved: therefore understand the matter, and consider the vision.



Understanding on what Keith? (<--- you mind answering that Keith)



It must be what was spoken of in Dan.8 and the visions Daniel didn't understand, with the 2300 days being one of them. The connection is there, the "overlap" is there.. Gabriel words confirms it. So you can't say the 2300 days doesn't play a part of what's being explained in Dan.9, because Gabriel came back to give Daniel understanding on things he didn't understand in Dan.8, and again, the 2300 days(evening and morning) was one of those visions Daniel didn't understand.


(ESV) Dan.8:26 The vision of the evenings and the mornings that has been told is true, but seal up the vision, for it refers to many days from now.”
27 And I, Daniel, was overcome and lay sick for some days. Then I rose and went about the king's business, but I was appalled by the vision and did not understand it.



See, lets the Bible speak for itself, Daniel didn't understand the evenings and mornings vision, why? because it was sealed up when Gabriel came the first time and wasn't explained.


What evenings and mornings can it be talking about Keith?


The only place to find "evenings and mornings" in that chapter is in verse 14.


(ESV) Dan.8:14 And he said to me,“For 2,300 evenings and mornings. Then the sanctuary shall be restored to its rightful state.”


Thank GOD by HIS Grace and heavy praying from Daniel, Gabriel came back years later to reveal the 2300 days(evenings & mornings)(Dan.9).



Again, no one can deny the 2300 days in Dan.8 that Daniel didn't understand was explain in Dan.9... How do we know?


Dan.9:22 And he informed me, and talked with me, and said, O Daniel, I am now come forth to give thee skill and understanding.


The only thing Gabriel could be giving Understanding on in Dan. 9, is what is in Dan.8, and the 2300 days is part of what is being explain, something Daniel didn't understand.



Blessings!

Thanks Reasoning Great post

Reasoning

I spent the day today with pastor Ken Cox. His new book" Daniel made simple " might be something you would enjoy.

He told me there is no way you can prove the IJ using Dan.8 and Dan. 9. His opinion.

Keith

RSS

Site Sponsors

 

Adventist Single?
Meet other Single
Adventists here:
Join Free


USA members:

Support AO by
using this link:
Amazon.com

 

© 2019   Created by Clark P.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service