Adventist Online

Travis mentioned this issue in the thread on "Hitler still missing according to MysteryQuest".

Are neutrons elementary particles?

Why should we care?

Views: 390

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

I don't think so.

No. Unless you're a physicist.
Dear Alexandria,

What do you mean by ''are neutrons elementary particles''?

Here are a few basic chemistry concepts:

''Atoms are basic components of the matter we are familiar with. Atoms are the smallest part of matter that have chemical properties characteristic of a particular chemical element. Most of the mass of an atom is due to the atomic nucleus. The nucleus consists of: protons which have a positive electrical charge and neutrons which have no charge.

The atomic number of an atom is the number of protons in the atom which, if the atom is neutral, equals the number of electrons. This is important because the number of electrons is related to the chemical properties of the atom. The atomic mass is the total mass of the electrons, protons, neutrons in the atom.

Electrons are small components which are surrounding the nucleus Electrons have a negative charge. An atom with no net electrical charge has the same number of electrons as protons. Electrons are restricted to certain energy levels ''shells'' and orbitals within those energy levels. These energy levels and orbitals fill in a regular pattern from the lowest energy level outward. Orbital is in some sense a bad word because electrons tend to behave rather strangely in that its orbit is best described as ''probability density''.

Chemical bonds are formed when electrons are transferred or shared between atoms. Electrons can carry and store energy and this is important in understanding metabolism. Every time a chemical reaction takes place, electrons are charged or transferred. For example, in photosynthesis light energy is captured and stored by electrons, Then the electrons are used to make glucose, and other organic molecules which store the energy as potential energy in their chemical bonds.

A knowledge of basic chemistry is important for understanding just about any area of biology, from the function of the cells to the behavior of organisms and ecological relationship between organisms and their environment. Indeed, chemists are fond of teasing biologists by claiming that all biology is chemistry. While this is not quite true, in order to make sense of the structure of cells, and organisms a little chemistry goes a long way.

Just a familiar example of chemistry: 2H2 + O2 ---- 2H2O (H2O pH =7 neutral)

H = 1 = Hydrogen --- an element with electron -- proton - neutron = atom
O= 2 = Oxygen ---- an element with electrons -- protons - neutrons = atom
H2O = molecule of water

There are 110 elements which are shown in the periodic table and the arrangement of the elements is by increasing atomic number. 26 elements are important to living things. These include the big six: Carbon, Hydrogen, Nitrogen, Oxygen, Phosphorus, and Sulfur. (CHNOPS). The rest are generally considered trace elements. They are often very important but needed in much smaller amounts.''

I could go on forever, chemistry is such a beautiful science and combined with biology = biochemistry. It is divided in inorganic and organic chemistry: that is why all apples are organic, but some are sprayed and some are not!

I wanted to write this to show that protons, neutrons and electrons are basic particles that form God's creation but I am not sure if we can call them elementary as they are quite intricate. They do form elements for sure so maybe that is what you meant. ''We are wonderfully made.''

This is why I do not like the idea of the Collider in Switzerland and their God's Particle. Man is never satisfied and wants to know more. I am nervous about what will this colliding of protons will bring now: first they splitted the atom and we got atomic energy -- then they made the first H bomb!

Then they got to the Nucleus and we got: Nuclear Energy --- and made Nuclear Bomb and every country under the sky wants its Nuclear Bomb now. So, what will they do with PROTONIC Energy. -- Do not know if they have used that term yet but that is what is coming: Protonic Bomb!

Much more energy, much more power. As for the quarks, quartum, black holes, I believe they are more than hypothesis. The secret has not been revealed yet but man by nature is curious but do not always use his discoveries wisely. Will the Creator allow him to go that far? I do not know. Just thought I would share one of my preferred science: the science of matter and how this world is made!

With His love,

Dear MsMs,

No worry! You are enrolled already! Is it not true what we learn here we will continue to learn unto eternity? The kingdom of heaven is in the midst of us! Christ in you the Hope of glory, the Hope of His perfect character.

With His love,

Dear Alexandria,

Evolution as far as chemistry is concerned, does not exist! Ask Lavoisier or Newton: NOTHING LOSS, NOTHING FOUND!

First principle you learn in chemistry! I learn that in my first year in chemistry in 1967. We have come a long way since but not yet far enough to my taste. I want to see Christ alive and vindicate His character. Time is running out though and we are not getting any younger. Although in His eyes we are just children.

Keep on studying, it will serve in the earth made new. What we learn here will continue to expand then.

I am not concerned about proving evolution false: I am the daughter of the Great King, not of some stupid apes. But I am concerned about what they will do when they can find out more about the protonic energy: hear the word of Einstein about atomic energy --- ''man has never invented an armament he has not used yet!'' That is my concern, because although brilliant compared with previous generation, this is the generation of Matt. 24: Two World War that killed more people than all the previous wars put together, many inventions that could cure all diseases, yet more diseases than ever. Not very pretty this generation!

May Christ's people answer the call!

With His love,

Dear Alexandria,

A few more details about the Hadron Collider and their numerous questions:

The Large Hadron Collider (LHC) is the world's largest and highest-energy particle accelerator, a synchrotron intended to collide opposing particle beams of either protons at an energy of 7 trillion electronvolts (1.12 microjoules) per particle, or lead nuclei at an energy of 574 TeV (92.0 µJ) per nucleus. The term hadron refers to particles composed of quarks. It is expected that it will address the most fundamental questions of physics, advancing our understanding of the deepest laws of nature. The LHC lies in a tunnel 27 kilometres (17 mi) in circumference, as much as 175 metres (574 ft) beneath the Franco-Swiss border near Geneva, Switzerland.

The Large Hadron Collider was built by the European Organization for Nuclear Research (CERN) with the intention of testing various predictions of high-energy physics, including the existence of the hypothesized Higgs boson and of the large family of new particles predicted by supersymmetry. It is funded by and built in collaboration with over 10,000 scientists and engineers from over 100 countries as well as hundreds of universities and laboratories.

On 10 September 2008, the proton beams were successfully circulated in the main ring of the LHC for the first time, but nine days later, operations were halted due to a serious fault between two superconducting bending magnets. Repairing the resulting damage and installing additional safety features took over a year. On 20 November 2009, the proton beams were successfully circulated again, with the first proton–proton collisions being recorded three days later at the injection energy of 450 GeV per beam. The LHC became the world's highest-energy particle accelerator on 30 November 2009, achieving a world record 1.18 TeV per beam and beating the record previously held by the Tevatron at Fermilab in Batavia, Illinois. After the 2009 winter shutdown, the LHC was restarted and the beam was ramped up to 3.5 TeV per beam, half its designed energy, which is planned for after its 2012 shutdown.

On 30 March 2010, the first planned collisions took place between two 3.5 TeV beams, which set a new world record for the highest-energy man-made particle collisions.

A simulated event in the CMS detector, featuring the appearance of the Higgs boson

Physicists hope that the LHC will help answer many of the most fundamental questions in physics, questions concerning the basic laws governing the interactions and forces among the elementary objects, the deep structure of space and time, especially regarding the intersection of quantum mechanics and general relativity, where current theories and knowledge are unclear or break down altogether. These issues include, at least:

* Is the Higgs mechanism for generating elementary particle masses via electroweak symmetry breaking indeed realised in nature? It is anticipated that the collider will either demonstrate or rule out the existence of the elusive Higgs boson(s), completing (or refuting) the Standard Model.
* Is supersymmetry, an extension of the Standard Model and Poincaré symmetry, realised in nature, implying that all known particles have supersymmetric partners?
* Are there extra dimensions, as predicted by various models inspired by string theory, and can we detect them?
* What is the nature of the Dark Matter which appears to account for 23% of the mass of the Universe?

Other questions are:
* Are electromagnetism, the strong nuclear force and the weak nuclear force just different manifestations of a single unified force, as predicted by various Grand Unification Theories?
* Why is gravity so many orders of magnitude weaker than the other three fundamental forces?
* Are there additional sources of quark flavours, beyond those already predicted within the Standard Model?
* Why are there apparent violations of the symmetry between matter and antimatter?
* What was the nature of the quark-gluon plasma in the early universe? This will be investigated by ion collisions in ALICE.

My Question is:

With His love,

I don't think there is any smallest particle. Because if there was, it would have to be made of something... and that would have to be made of something... etc.
Dear Alexandra,

That is correct, although Newton and Galileo could define gravity as a force, no one has ever been able to identify the FORCE that produces the force of gravity!. It is the same mysterious Being who makes the heart of a fetus to beat even though it is not connected to any arteries yet! The Miracles and Mysteries of the Creator are unsearchable.

With His love,

Dear Alexandria,

I would not be too quick in making such statement because do you know that before WW 2, before the discovery of atomic energy, scientists had declared that everything that was to be discovered in chemistry was discovered: than came the BOMB!

What may be discovered is the Revelation of the Creator Himself and the manifestation of His knowledge and power to humble them in their so-called advance knowledge. Even the theory of Einstein: E=MC2 is being questioned now. Man has a point of view, the Creator has a VIEW of all the POINTS.

With His love,

I don't think that not finding the Higgs Boson would prove anything. Actually finding it might.
Dear Travis,

''And God said...''

With His love,

Dear Just Me,

That is exactly it!

There is always something they will search for rather than acknowledging that at the beginning, God made matter of out nothing as HE SPOKE it into matter.

A quark is an elementary particle and a fundamental constituent of matter. Quarks combine to form composite particles called hadrons, the most stable of which are protons and neutrons, the components of atomic nuclei. Due to a phenomenon known as color confinement, quarks are never found in isolation; they can only be found within hadrons. For this reason, much of what is known about quarks has been drawn from observations of the hadrons themselves.

And that is what their purpose is in Switzerland -- to prove the existence of quarks and God's particle, by attempting to collide protons. Nothing Lost -- Nothing Found.

Even though they may be able to identify the quark or at least generate it trough their accelerator, they will not be satisfied. The next project will be to recreate it at a larger scale. Some even believe they might be creating stargates and attempt to transport man to another galaxy through all that energy created. Foolishness some may say -- ''The fool says in his heart, There is no God'' so I suppose their dream is to use that energy to create something or reproduce something they believe possible: travel to other galaxies.

The Bible speaks about that impossible dream and it is a possible dream only available to those who receive the gift of Christ in the sanctuary and are transformed at the latter days. Then we will be able to travel like Enoch and see other worlds. It will be nothing then to defy gravity, and neutrons and protons along with the complete atom will be restored, which I am sure have been affected by sin as well, since our corruptible body has known death and decay.

I am glad the Heavenly Father is omniscient and knows how to preserve our character for that Great Day. And we will be changed then with the twinkle of an eye. That is enough science to keep us busy unto eternity!

All of these so-called advance terminology of neutrinos, anti-neutrinos, quark, hadron, etc, is at the theoretical level and the scientists hope is to prove all this and more through the Hadron Collider in Switzerland. I am still concerned about the electro-magnetic field and if it will not affect the core and the crust of the earth that are already so unstable with all the experiments done in the past and now with HAARP, the other Colliders and High and Low Frequency stations they have established besides HAARP.

May the Heavenly Father protect His own, that is all I pray so we can finish His work and vindicate His name. Then the end can come! I pray the same zeal that animates the scientists in their research of the unknown, which I am not sure if it is from above or from below, may the true zeal from Above, take over us and give us power to give the Rev. 14 and 18 messages and create a Big Bang of its own to wake up the world of the soon ending of the judgment and the Coming of Christ.

With His love,

Let's take this discussion in another direction and look at an answer the to second question. Why should we care?

In 1 Corinthians 15:51, 52 Paul says: "51Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet." The word translated here as "flash" and in the KJV as "moment" is the Greek word "atomo". The meaning of this word has nothing to do with time. It was commonly used in Greek philosophy and science to describe the smallest particle possible.

The Greeks did not have the scientific tools to identify the chemical elements we can now identify. They only knew four elements and those are not elements as modern chemistry identifies them. The four elements the Greeks identified could more accurately be described as a very inadequate understanding of the four states of matter: solid, liquid, gas and plasma. But that is not important to this question. The word element literally means the smallest part possible, and when chemists were seeking a word to use for these new kinds of "elements" they discovered, they chose the Greek word that had the same meaning.

It did not take them long to discover that these "elements" really were not elements at all because they were all made up of protons, neutrons and electrons, which in turn have been theorized to be made up of quarks and mesons, and those to be made up of still smaller particles.

Paul's point in 1 Corinthians 15 is that when we receive the Glorified (or incorruptible, or immortal) body, the change that makes this body will occur not only momentarily (in the twinkling of an eye -- here the Greek word is rhipe, meaning a jerking or darting motion, so is a quick glance) and in the smallest particle of our being. Likely this is symbolic of the changes in our personality that make it possible to have perfect obedience, but Paul is also clearly speaking of our physical bodies.

Whatever the change that gives us the glorified body Paul believed it would take place at the elemental level, not meaning in the atoms as modern chemistry defines them, but even more elemental than that. It does not matter to me if this elemental particle has been proven to exist, merely theorized, or not yet even conceived of by man. It is at this level that God will provide the change that makes it possible for me to never sin again.


Site Sponsors


Adventist Single?
Meet other Single
Adventists here:
Join Free

USA members:

Support AO by
using this link:


© 2020   Created by Clark P.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service