Adventist Online

Is music with drums along with rock/jazz/blues styles OK for worship in church? As long as the lyrics are good, what’s the problem? Does Ellen White have any light on the subject, or does she not speak to modern times?

It is impossible to estimate too largely the work that the Lord will accomplish through His proposed vessels in carrying out His mind and purpose. The things you have described as taking place in Indiana, the Lord has shown me would take place just before the close of probation. Every uncouth thing will be demonstrated. There will be shouting, with drums, music, and dancing. The senses of rational beings will become so confused that they cannot be trusted to make right decisions. And this is called the moving of the Holy Spirit. {2SM 36.2}
The Holy Spirit never reveals itself in such methods, in such a bedlam of noise. This is an invention of Satan to cover up his ingenious methods for making of none effect the pure, sincere, elevating, ennobling, sanctifying truth for this time. Better never have the worship of God blended with music than to use musical instruments to do the work which last January was represented to me would be brought into our camp meetings. The truth for this time needs nothing of this kind in its work of converting souls. A bedlam of noise shocks the senses and perverts that which if conducted aright might be a blessing. The powers of satanic agencies blend with the din and noise, to have a carnival, and this is termed the Holy Spirit's working.
37
{2SM 36.3}

Views: 4673

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

Actually, the message is what brings demons.  For instance, while I was in college, I had a get together at my apartment.  A girl I knew brought some music I was unfamiliar with.  The author was Rob Zombie.  After she played that there, I awoke in the morning to realize I wasn't alone, and there was not another human in the apartment but me.  So, it is the message that attracts evil.  I had to pray and cleanse my apartment so I could be "alone" again.

bro it is not the instrument, but how it is used. and who it is used by.

Did you know that YOU are an instrument? Yes we ALL are instruments and we put out music. How our music (praise) sounds is depending on who is influencing us. We ALL have been lead astray and have put out the enemy's music. But thanks to the grace of Christ Jesus, we can put out lovely music in honor to Jesus, and still be the same instrument! Thats a sermon!

Excellent Heisenberg! 

Most Christians would not have a clue of what to do. Most Christians are afraid of demons (though just like rattle snakes, we need to be aware of their danger). 

The rare Christian who knows the authority he has in Christ and exercises it makes the spirits nervous and obedient, though they will try to resist or fool you.  Many Christians are pushovers and many are limp wristed and could not punch their way out of a paper bag.

Failure to believe in, understand, teach, mentor and use the nine manifestations of holy spirit with love and power is the problem, along with institutionalized tradition of quenching the spirit, instead of believing and acting on guidance by walking by the spirit. People criticize, accuse, attack and yet NEVER believe God and step out in faith and boldly do what should be done as you did, Mr. Heisenberg! I commend you for taking correct spiritual action!

Dancing and drums should never be introduced in the house of God 

“The things you have described as taking place in Indiana, the Lord has shown me would take place just before the close of probation. Every uncouth thing will be demonstrated. There will be shouting, with drums, music, and dancing. The senses of rational beings will become so confused that they cannot be trusted to make right decisions. And this is called the moving of the Holy Spirit.  

The Holy Spirit never reveals itself in such methods, in such a bedlam of noise. This is an invention of Satan to cover up his ingenious methods for making of none effect the pure, sincere, elevating, ennobling, sanctifying truth for this time. Better never have the worship of God blended with music than to use musical instruments to do the work which last January was represented to me would be brought into our camp meetings. 

“The truth for this time needs nothing of this kind in its work of converting souls. A bedlam of noise shocks the senses and perverts that which if conducted aright might be a blessing. The powers of satanic agencies blend with the din and noise, to have a carnival, and this is termed the Holy Spirit's working. 

“Those participating in the supposed revival receive impressions which lead them adrift. They cannot tell what they formerly knew regarding Bible principles. No encouragement should be given to this kind of worship. {Selected Messages, 2:36-37)

“I feel alarmed as I witness everywhere the frivolity of young men and young women who profess to believe the truth. God does not seem to be in their thoughts. Their minds are filled with nonsense. Their conversation is only empty, vain talk. They have a keen ear for music, and Satan knows what organs to excite to animate, engross, and charm the mind so that Christ is not desired. The spiritual longings of the soul for divine knowledge, for a growth in grace, are wanting.

“I was shown that the youth must take a higher stand and make the word of God the man of their counsel and their guide. Solemn responsibilities rest upon the young, which they lightly regard. The introduction of music into their homes, instead of inciting to holiness and spirituality, has been the means of diverting their minds from the truth. Frivolous songs and the popular sheet music of the day seem congenial to their taste. The instruments of music have taken time which should have been devoted to prayer. Music, when not abused, is a great blessing; but when put to a wrong use, it is a terrible curse. It excites, but does not impart that strength and courage which the Christian can find only at the throne of grace while humbly making known his wants and, with strong cries and tears, pleading for heavenly strength to be fortified against the powerful temptations of the evil one. Satan is leading the young captive. Oh, what can I say to lead them to break his power of infatuation! He is a skillful charmer luring them on to perdition. {Adventist Home, p. 407-408}

I find it really interesting that this one text out of context is used over and over. The critical thinker has to ask who was she writing to and what were the circumstances she was addressing? However I never hear that discussed at all. More than once the White's addressed fanatics in our early church history. Why aren't people addressing her statements about dry lifeless singing as well? Why are they not addressing Organs that are played so loudly that you can't hear the congregation at all? Why aren't they addressing the Prima donna's that lead our church music only to be seen and heard of men and women? What is frivolous music is it music with only drums in it? Is it music with no spiritual value?  " bedlam of noise" is the Really Big Topic. It is this fanaticism that allowed people to dance around in a wild frenzy, it is this music that was called worship in and of itself. Much as the Holy laughter or the speaking in Tongues is today.  There is much music that is in our Hymnal that has unholy and ungody tunes attached to holy words. Music should not be the topic of division that it has become. Lets get about what we were called to do in mt 28: 19,20. Lets give the 3 angels messages with courtesy, power grace, mercy and love. lets get ready to meet a holy GOD. I have an idea that ALL of us are going to have to learn to sing in a new way starting with our trip t o heaven and during that first 1,000 years.

Racist conclusion. Nothing matter with the drum.

I'm with you Leon. I am a drummer and also play a little bass, vibes. I played nice music in religious organizations and the music blessed the believers. We had keyboard and flutes and singing, and in another group various instruments including bass and guitar. I actually felt the presence of the holy spirit in the auditorium. I had never experienced that before that. The drums I did were mellow, as we took scriptures and turned them into music. The drums augmented and added to the music with cymbal and drum arrangements. I often play with brushes.

Some of you are so caught up in bondage, and religiosity that it is literally sickening. Some of you neither understand nor apparently have experienced the wide range of liberty and freedom there is within "God's will,' nor do you even begin to understand the holy spirit, yet you are so opinionated and adamant about your beliefs without sound scriptural and spiritual basis for your pontifications.

The degree of prejudice, backbiting as exhibited against Leon and myself is totally outrageous on this site from a few of you. I have met many very kind and intelligent SDA people who I am still friends with, even on this site, we mutually respect each other even though we disagree on a few things here and there. I am available to spiritually help anyone who asks, as I do have some experience in casting out demons and ministering of healing, acting as a pastor and leading people to Christ, leading people into the operations of the holy spirit etc. My prayer list is now at 200, including many SDA, and Christians from other denominations and others.

I and others consider Jazz to be a very high form of music. Like anything else, like books, art, etc., music can be inspired by God and edifying or enlightening in some manner, or just for soothing people. Music can be healing. (David used music to drive the spirits out of Saul). Music and other things can also be inspired by the Devil or demons. The degree of ignorance that is in some Christian churches and practices gives God a bad name. No wonder many don't want anything to do with "Christianity."

You make rash judgments here, rash judgments there...without any sound Biblical authority, nor any true spiritual authority. Most of you wouldn't recognize a subtle Devil Spirit if it fell off the wall and hit you on the head. The almost total lack of fully implementing the Great Commission in all its aspects throughout most of Christianity means that the pastors don't know how or want to deal with demons that are causing great havoc in both the Christian community, within families and individuals; leading to sickness, death, depression, and lack of vital spiritual relationship with God and His Son, and total grieving of the holy spirit.

God must be sick at the state of Christianity, for I certainly am. My words are not for you reasonable people who do the best you can with what you understand, and operate the love of God, as your leaders and your teachers lack spiritual understanding and power. Even during the time of Paul's life, all Asia had turned away from him and his teachings, which were given by revelation of Jesus Christ. This and Constantine lead to complete institutionalized idolatry and man worship. Popes, pastors, priests and whatever;  EGW even!

Usually the people that make these rash and foolish judgments about what is proper, godly or ungodly about the arts and Christianity, are not in the arts at all, and yet they are so opinionated. I have seen it for 50 years. I have also seen the complete lack of spiritual power in 95% of the churches, with about 4% of the rest being counterfeit power or frauds, or mixed genuine spirit of God and Demons in operation. That leaves about 1% of God's people or churches operating somewhat according to God's word rightly divided on holy spirit principles.

Oh, and at least 30,000 "pastors" are paid government agents bought and paid for by the Federal "government" (officially called Clergy Response Teams) to read only a misinterpretation of Romans 13 to lead their "flock" into the FEMA camps when the time comes and to have them peacefully except the economic collapse, internment, brain washing, torture, forced vaccine injections containing deadly mercury, as well as the planned execution of 13 out of 14 people on the earth on record that the globalists have planned. No other interpretation or scriptures will be allowed at the proper time.

Perhaps this country and much of our population deserve the judgment that is coming, and it is coming, whether you think so or not. If judgment must begin, it must begin at the house of God. For those persons who operate the love of God, and practice with humility Christianity to the best of their ability with what they know, considering the lack of depth of understanding, I would say that prepare for the worst, but trust in God that He will protect you.

But without experience in hearing the voice of God, in obeying it and operating the spirit and power of God, you will be in very difficult situation. You don't believe in speaking in tongues, don't know how to command demons out or control them when they come after you to do harm. What are you to do? You better start thinking about more important issues then drums in the church, because the New World Order War drums have been beating for 100 years or more, and most of you never even heard it nor believe it. I hope you don't have to find out the hard way. My post here is a bit harsh, as reality can be harsh. Your leaders are not ready to deal with the New World Order and you can't even believe and practice the Great Commission in its totality. I hope someone wakes up and smells the coffee, oh you don't believe in coffee either.

Regarding Timbrels, a small hand drum from scriptures:

"As regards the timbrel specifically, it corresponds to spiritual good, that is, to the good of truth. The reason is that the timbrel is not a stringed instrument, neither is it a wind instrument, but as it is made with a skin, it is as it were a continuous stringed instrument, and moreover its sound is graver and deeper than is the sound of stringed instruments. This can also be seen from the Word, where the timbrel is mentioned, as in Isaiah:--

The joy of the timbrels shall cease, the tumult of the joyous shall cease, the joy of the harp shall cease (Isa. 24:8);

the joy of the timbrels denotes the delights of the affections of the good of faith; the joy of the harp, the delight of the affection of the truth of faith. In Jeremiah:--

Anew I will build thee, that thou shalt be built, O virgin of Israel; anew shalt thou adorn thy timbrels, and shalt go forth into the dance of them that play (Jer. 31:4);

to adorn the timbrels denotes to glorify God from spiritual good, for it treats of the spiritual church, which is the virgin of Israel.

[4] In like manner in Ezekiel:--

Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God, the work of thy timbrels and of thy pipes was in thee, in the day that thou wast created they were prepared (Ezek. 28:13);

speaking of Tyre, by which are signified the knowledges of good and of truth, and by timbrels and pipes the affections of the former, and the joys of the latter. In David:--

They have seen Thy goings, O God, the goings of my God in the sanctuary. The singers went before, after them the players, in the midst of the virgins playing on timbrels (Ps. 68:24, 25).

Shout to the God of Jacob, lift up a song, and give a timbrel, a pleasant harp with a psaltery (Ps. 81:1, 2).

Sing to Jehovah a new song, let them praise His name in the dance, let them sing psalms to Him with timbrel and harp (Ps. 149:1, 3);

here to praise with timbrel denotes to glorify from the delight of the affection of the good of faith; and to praise with harp denotes the pleasantness of the affection of the truth of faith.

[5] In the same:--

Praise ye God with timbrel and dance, praise ye Him with stringed instruments and organ, praise Him with cymbals of sound, praise Him with cymbals of noise (Ps. 150:4, 5);

to praise with timbrel and dance denotes from the good and truth of faith; with stringed instruments and organ denotes from truths and the good thence derived. As by correspondence all instruments signified the delights and pleasantnesses of spiritual and celestial affections, many of the Psalms of David have an inscription, and it is told how they are to be sung, as upon Neginothupon Nechilothupon the OctaveShigajonGitthithMuth-labbenSheminithShoshannimMachalath.

From: http://www.biblemeanings.info/Words/Music/Timbrel.htm

AGAIN, THE UNDUE PREJUDICES AGAINST ALL "DRUMS." HAS NO BASIS IN TRUTH AS A BLANKET DOCTRINE FOR ANY "CHURCH." WHAT IS A CHURCH; BUT THE BODY OF BELIEVERS, NOT A BUILDING. GOD DWELLS EVERYWHERE. THE FIRST CENTURY CHURCH WAS INCREDIBLE AND THE WORD MOVED OVER THE WORLD, AND THEY MET IN HOMES AND HAD NO WRITTEN SCRIPTURES OTHER THAN THE OLD TESTAMENT, AND THE INSPIRATION OF AND GUIDANCE OF THE HOLY SPIRIT (THE VOICE OF THE LORD).

There is not an evil instrument in itself.

Only the how and the intent.

Psalms 150 basically says to empty the kitchen cupboards and bring it all to Praise GOD!

Everything you hAVE!

If you play a flute..play it unto the LORD

Guitar and harmonica and piano and the auto harp (my old country church memories).

:)

Of course if you gift is drums  (and have a set) that's what u bring unto the LORD!

.

We bring the  all of us to HIM! And God blesses our imperfect efforts.

.

I go to a small church building and when they get out the trumpets I have to put in the ear plugs cause I have sensitive ears!

A small building cannot dissipate such an obnoxious sound.

I can't very well tell them not to play it cause I don't like it or offended that a big loud brassy instrument ruins my day.

It is what that person has to give to the LORD.

I wish my parents had me take fiddle lessons! If they did..That is what I have to give to the LORD.

amen

No instrument is bad in itself.

.It is fitting that our Bible's last chapter in Psalms is all about PRAISE with anything you can strum or blow or bang on. The whole book leads up to that !

We think God only likes what we like.

That is making GOD in our own Image.

Timbrels (psalms 154) are Tambourines! lol

You should hear what a ruckus  what they make. lol lol

.

and it says even Praise HIM in DANCE!

another thread in the working maybe?

God bless!

It seems very innocent to let it come into use, but is something that is destroying many churches worship service, so need to be aware of its influence.

I am a drummer. I am a different kind of drummer than most. Yes, I can rock it up  and smash it up and make a very big lot of noise...but, I spent most of my years playing in country music bands and clubs where I learned to just use the stick on the side of the snare drum behind certain people and in certain songs. I was invited...and allowed, to play the drums in certain things in church and programs because I was a "soft playing" drummer compared to others. This kind of playing was acceptable because I played by "just being there". There was nothing "hypnotic" about my playing. So I think that drums should never be totally excluded from anywhere....but the Pastor etc needs to check our how they are played. I mean any instrument can be used in a bad  or unacceptable way...so we could say the same thing about louder instruments....yes, some instruments can be louder than drums lol. God gave me the gift of being able to play...He taught me how to play..I used to say I did it because I did not have lessons..but I can do nothing without Him....He was my teacher. I played for Him..and for who I was backing.

RSS

Site Sponsors

 

Adventist Single?
Meet other Single
Adventists here:
Join Free


USA members:

Support AO by
using this link:
Amazon.com

 

© 2019   Created by Clark P.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service