Hi Brother Darlington, grace and peace.
Why Oh Why Brethren, whenever someone is corrected of error, is the person or persons who correct, automatically labeled (JUDGED) as judging, condemning or casting stones. You presume to understand (JUDGE) my motives as being judgmental, although my motives have been plainly pointed out, in black and white, for all to see and read, in earlier posts.
There is only one accuser of the Brethren, DO NOT LEND HIM YOUR WORDS.
I pray the Holy Spirit would show you the folly of your error, lovingly, kindly, patiently, but assuredly.
If you want to treat her, as Jesus would have, (lovingly, mercifully), then follow His Word.
This young lady is being HAMMERED by satan, with guild, condemnation, rejection, self worthlessness etc etc.
He is telling her, constantly, "people are looking, they are talking about you, they are judging you", and we know satan is a liar. If this young lady was encouraged to openly confess that she made a mistake, has repented, and asks forgiveness, she is, in fact, spiritually, SLAMMING THE DOOR IN HIS FACE, opening the door for reconciliation.
What happens when we are reconciled? LOVE, GRACE, MERCY, ENCOURAGEMENT ETC ETC ETC. WITHOUT MEASURE.
Don't talk about MANS LOVE (sentimentalism) because it destroys GODS LOVE.
His ways are so much nobler and higher than our best intentions.
Once again, my Brethren, Gods Word should be your measuring rod.
Proverbs 13:24 He that spareth his rod hateth his son: but he that loveth him chasteneth him betimes.
Ezekiel 3:17 Son of man, I have made thee a watchman unto the house of Israel: therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me. 3:18 When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked [man] shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.
Do not judge me, presuming to know my motives, you are laying yourself a snare.
I pray God bless you abundantly, Scott.
Dear Sister, Redva, grace and peace.
This is a discussion, in which, I am jealously, standing for Gods Word, concerning this subject. I concede only to the fact that some people would obviously rather hear a lie (as sweet as it is), than Gods true council.
I have never made any suggestions, mearly, laid Gods Word for you to see. I have never separated love, from what I have written, nor how I have meant it. God is love, how then can it be separate from His Word, who is Christ, who is God?!
Gods Word may, however, appear too harsh (in some peoples eyes) in the face of your sentimentalism.
Do not confuse the two.
Happy Sabbath, Scott.
Dearest Sister Redva, grace and peace.
With the utmost of respect, please allow me to put this into context for you.
You said: "Bruce i have not only quoted our loving Saviours words (not mine) but also Hi actions towards the people He came to save, in several of my replies before so I am neither sentimental or emotional but Bibical and Spiritual. It is taking you a mighty long time to decern. Hope you will soon"
Now, firstly, in all 36 of your posts, you have in fact not quoted even ONE Scripture to support your views and opinions . However, in fairness you have given your personal interpretation of four Scriptures, which you paraphrased, and they were all in only ONE of your posts. (not that I disagree with your interpretations). So most definitely not, for the most part of what you have had to say, our Loving Saviour's Words, but mostly YOUR OWN.
I have quoted directly from Scripture 27 Bible verses, to which you have responded to NONE.
For the most part, your views and sentiments are based upon your own opinions and/or emotions.
You have discerned, in your own wisdom: 1. What is human. 2. What baptism is (twice). 3. When a plea for forgiveness is needed (twice). 4. You have passed judgement on the Church (four times). 5. What sin is. 6. That a public apology is Traumatic and Torturous. 7. What the Churches responsibility is. 8. Preempted how the Church WOULD respond. 9. You give honor to GREAT MINDS. 10. discern what censure is. 11. What pastors should do. 12. What is fit for saving souls (anything). 13. Make suggestions based on Church Manual which are contrary to Scripture. 14. Decide what both Gods and the Churches roles are. 15. Seem to know what the Church is not praying for. 16. Make presumptuous suggestions about what I understand. 17. You discern that I am not fit for heaven. 18. When to give testimonies. 19. And lastly, you call Scripture that I have quoted, suggestions. AND FOR NOT ONE OF THE ABOVE HAVE YOU PRESENTED SOUND SCRIPTURAL EVIDENCE.
My dear Sister, I pray you would re-read my, and others, posts, where clear Scriptural evidence has been presented you. Everything else is just SHIFTING SAND.
God bless, Scott.
Thanks Scott, good morning. How was the Sabbath? Hope you were blessed.
Its obvious from such comprehensive summary that you spent much time and combed through all the replies. But my friend you seem to misunderstand much of it. It appears that you read the responses with a closed mind and you were too subjective to accept the truths presented (by all) objectively. Your quotes were accurate but your interpretations bias based on your subjective thoughts Scott.
You seem to have much time at your disposal, which unfortunately I do not have. Before the end of day however, I am going to attach or add all the references to all my quotes and rephrased all those paraphrased passages in one summary for you.
What about all the other quotes and references from the other brethren, who gave solid facts. I never saw the need to repeat the references made since I was merely replying to them.
I still do not believe that up to this point that you still believe, that in a practical and realistic way that the young sister going through such embarrassing, traumatic, frightening, vexing, hurting and .... (you may add more) situation should be called before the church to apologize. Where is your heart in this Scott? O come on my friend. The mere thought of it gives me chills as a woman and as a human.
Love is not something said, it is something done. I am a school administrator (22 yrs). I have been in the school system for over 30 years and i must tell you, harsh punishments do not work 95% of the times they are applied. What the children and teenagers respond to is kindness, understanding, thoughtfulness and consideration which spring from love in action. Because of this I started a new project where no unkind or harsh word is to be spoken in dealing with the students.The students conform much better and more to this kind of intervention. All the scriptures (even though I did not write the references) that I alluded to (and others), are of similar loving approach.
I guess your training as a law enforcement office (hope I am not wrong, if I am I stand corrected) somewhat influence the position you take. I guess if you clear your mind via the Holy Spirit prompting, Scott you will see things differently.
Catch up on you later on with the discussion, going off to an elders' training session at the conference office so when I return I will try to continue the discussion. I will follow it on my phone as much as possible in the meanwhile.
Sister Redva, grace and peace.
Once again, IN ALL DUE RESPECT, all has been said on this matter. I will not be commenting any more on this post.
God bless you, in brotherly love, Scott.
Thanks Scott but I will keep my promise to provide you with all the references. I really love this discussion with you. It was deep, interesting and provocative one. God bless you my friend and thanks for you input.
The belly is there, it is a result of sexual intercourse (not an immaculate conception) so no confession is necessary. If she was involved in sex and did not get pregnant or caught or if she stole some money, or broke a shop or killed someone etc and the Holy Spirit convicts her of the sin; then, in such cases she could come forward (if she wants) and confess her wrongs to free her from the guilt and them go through the process to baptism.
Coming forward with her big belly will only bring ridicule, scuffing, criticism in the church- I think I know so well.
Coming forward there will be: No closure, no stopping of rumors, and judging will continue.
When Christ forgives He sets free and that one is free indeed.