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a. 144,000 is Literal (as in)

b. 144,000 is Symbolical, but it is different from Great Multitude

c. 144,000 is Symbolical, and part of the Great Multitude

d. 144, 000 is the Symbolical number of the Great Multitude

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I have looked at his info. as well as research by many other pastors, and am inclined to disagree with pastor Doug on this one.

I too, disagree with Mr.  Batchelor.

It is the literal number of Jews that have been sealed before the spiritaul famine began toward the end of the first century.  The christian world is still in the spiritual famine because they are lacking what the 144,000 had.  They had the Gospel of Jesus via spirit and truth.  There is no lie found in them.  They kept the commandments of God to have the testimony of Jesus.  Christians just read about the myths and legends of the men and women of the past who had the word of God Via spirit and truth.

 

Blessings

I don't mean to get picky here, Todd, but they are a literal number of Israelites from all the tribes. Those they call the Jews are from Judah, Benjamin, and Levi.  

So, Mr. Vetter, just what do these Christians need to know? 

Maybe, we should start with the term, in English, "forever".  Can you give me the full meaning ( all of them) in Hebrew? 

Ronald, the numbering scenario you mention certainly has a rationale and a logic to it, and yet when Israel were numbered (Numbers chapters 2 & 26), weren't the people entirely capable of the feat? And they were a multitude much greater than 144,000. 

I think it significant that the Spirit of Prophecy places the Great Multitude in the new word, and for this reason I believe it denotes all of the redeemed. I'm not aware that it gives the "great multitude" a setting anywhere else.

Prophets and Kings p.720-721

"The seer of Patmos, looking down through the ages to the time of this restoration of Israel in the earth made new, testified: 

"I beheld, and lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; and cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb."

Thank you Ronald. Yes, I did mean, "In the new world". The things you are saying here have sent me to look for more clarification, and for that I am grateful. I am suddenly beginning to question my long-held view on this subject. Wonderful !

That's a good logic sir...but I am incline to believe that 144,000 is symbolical number of the Great multitude...for that is what the Bible and the Spirit of Prophecy tells and says,...

It's good to use our reasoning, but I believe it should not over rule the claims and teachings of the Bible

That's is also the quotation that will support the claims of the Bible...

Just because it came from the Spirit of Prophecy, doesn't mean we will no longer apply the right way of interpretation for it...

What Ma'am Leslie had quoted is called in the English as restrictive clause...meaning in that sentence there are words that when being remove, it will not affect the whole sentence...let me share it to you...

The living saints, 144,000 in number, knew and understood the voice, while the wicked thought it was thunder and an earthquake. {Mar 287.3}

 


Now let us remove the 144,000 in number shall we...

The living saints knew and understood the voice, while the wicked thought it was thunder and an earthquake. {Mar 287.3}

 


Question...does the removal of 144,000 in number affect the whole sentence...definitely no...because the whole point of the quotation is to point out that the living saints of God knew and understood His voice...

So to make more light, the putting of 144,000 in number is not to stress that it is their number in the last days, but to show that the living saints can be identified as the 144,000...or in other words the living saints is also known as the 144,000...

And if we are to look at it, the quotation did not claim that the 144,000 is literal...

One more thing, the background of this quotation is that, in the time of Ellen G. White...there is a man who claim that the 144,000 is literal...and Ellen G. White uttered that quotation the tell to that man or counsel him that she did not say anything whether 144,000 is literal...what she is saying is we should strive by God's grace to become part of it...

God bless!

Jierd, Ellen G White was intelligent enough to write what she intended. It does no one any good to remove portians and try to make it seem like she said something that she did not.

amen Ronald!!

Amen Ezra!!

@Ezra

Amen!

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