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How does the testimonies of Jesus refer to the Spirit of Prophecy?

Revelations 12:17

I have to tell someone that the testimonies of Jesus is the SOP but I have no idea how to explain that if the person asks. Can anyone please help?

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Tan, the holy Sabbath day, the fourth commandment, does not include the feast days. To observe these feast days is to deny Christ. Feast days are not part of the ten commandments
Peace


Jason: "Tan, the Holy Sabbath day, the fourth commandment, does not include the feast days. To observe these feast days is to deny Christ. Feast days are not part of the Ten Commandments"



Right and wrong brother Jason, the Holy set days of GOD (Lev.23) are not part of the 10 C's, but they found in the morals laws written in the book.... Which you know many other morals laws are found. To observe the Annual Holy set days of GOD is not denying Christ. Paul and Luke knew that it wasn't...




EGW: "At Philippi Paul tarried to keep the Passover. Only Luke remained with him, the other members of the company passing on to Troas to await him there. The Philippians were the most loving and truehearted of the apostle’s converts, and during the eight days of the feast he enjoyed peaceful and happy communion with them."– {AA 390.4}



That's not done away with Jason.... Are they denying Christ?


They didn't have to observed the Feast days if they were a sin to observed Jason, there was no pressure on them to observed the Holy set days of GOD. But the facts show they observed the whole eight days of the Holy feast of GOD with the converts. I'm sorry but that's not done away with.



Daniel 7:25 (King James Version)
"And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and time


Few other translations says



Daniel 7:25 (Amplified Bible)
"And he shall speak words against the Most High [God] and shall wear out the saints of the Most High and think to change the time [of sacred feasts and holy days] and the law; and the saints shall be given into his hand for a time, two times, and half a time [three and one-half years].



Daniel 7:25 (New Living Translation)
"He will defy the Most High and oppress the holy people of the Most High. He will try to change their sacred festivals and laws, and they will be placed under his control for a time, times, and half a time.



Dan. 7:25 (New American Bible)
"He shall speak against the Most High and oppress the holy ones of the Most High, thinking to change the feast days and the law. They shall be handed over to him for a year, two years, and a half-year.



Dan.7:25 (Wycliffe Bible)
"And he shall speak words against the High GOD, and he shall defoul the saints of the HighestHigh; and he shall guess, that he may change times and laws (And he shall speak words against the Most Hight GOD, and he shall defile, or shall oppress, the saints of the Most GODHigh; and he shall think, that he can change the times for the feast, and the laws); and they shall be given into his hands, till to time, and times, and the half of time.





How do we know what GOD feast days are, just look in Lev.23, the main one is the 7th day Sabbath and Then HE tells us of the annual Holy set days.



Does the one who speaks against the Most High say anything about changing GOD'S annual Holy set days?





This is from the Catechism of Pope Pius X:

2 Q. What are festivals?

A. In the Old Law they were Saturdays and certain other days regarded as specially solemn by the Jews; in the New Law they are Sundays and other festivals instituted by the Church.


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"The Cath. Church abolished not only the Sabbath, but all the other Jewish festivals. Pray and study. I shall be always glad to help you as long as you honestly seek the truth. Respectfully, T.
Enright CSSR.” June 1905




The devil counterfeits everything. The truth is there, whether you accept it or not is a different story.



Blessings!
Those who insist on observing feast days now, are not led by the Holy Spirit.


Great controversy chapter 22 from page s 399
The slaying of the Passover lamb was a shadow of the death of Christ. Says Paul: "Christ our Passover is sacrificed for us." 1 Corinthians 5:7. The sheaf of first fruits, which at the time of the Passover was waved before the Lord, was typical of the resurrection of Christ. Paul says, in speaking of the resurrection of the Lord and of all His people: "Christ the first fruits; afterward they that are Christ's at His coming." 1 Corinthians 15:23. Like the wave sheaf, which was the first ripe grain gathered before the harvest, Christ is the first fruits of that immortal harvest of redeemed ones that at the future resurrection shall be gathered into the garner of God.

These types were fulfilled, not only as to the event, but as to the time. One of the fourteenth day of the first Jewish month, the very day and month on which for fifteen long centuries the Passover lamb had been slain, Christ, having eaten the Passover with His disciples, instituted that feast which was to commemorate His own death as "the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world." That same night He was taken by wicked hands to be crucified and slain. And as the antitype of the wave sheaf our Lord was raised from the dead on the third day, "the first fruits of them that slept," a sample of all the resurrected just, whose "vile body" shall be changed, and "fashioned like unto His glorious body." Verse 20; Philippians 3:21.

In like manner the types which relate to the second advent must be fulfilled at the time pointed out in the symbolic

Page 400

service. Under the Mosaic system the cleansing of the sanctuary, or the great Day of Atonement, occurred on the tenth day of the seventh Jewish month (Leviticus 16:29-34), when the high priest, having made an atonement for all Israel, and thus removed their sins from the sanctuary, came forth and blessed the people. So it was believed that Christ, our great High Priest, would appear to purify the earth by the destruction of sin and sinners, and to bless His waiting people with immortality. The tenth day of the seventh month, the great Day of Atonement, the time of the cleansing of the sanctuary, which in the year 1844 fell upon the twenty-second of October, was regarded as the time of the Lord's coming. This was in harmony with the proofs already presented that the 2300 days would terminate in the autumn, and the conclusion seemed irresistible.
Peace



Jason: "Those who insist on observing feast days now, are not led by the Holy Spirit."




Not true brother Jason, the first half of EGW quote speaks of ceremonies done on the Holy set days of GOD... The next half speaks about the Holy days, the Holy set times, and how in Oct. 22, 1844 (which is way after the cross) was the Day of Atonement. This clearly shows GOD uses HIS Holy set times to do HIS work for the redemption of HIS people after the cross.

How do you believe that ended at the cross, when facts show GOD uses HIS times (Holy set days) to do HIS work after the cross?


The example of the early church is our example, we teach if they are still observing GOD Holy days after the cross, then it shows it wasn't done away with... SOP shows us Luke, Paul and his converts observing the Holy set times of GOD some twenty years after the cross.



EGW: "At Philippi Paul tarried to keep the Passover. Only Luke remained with him, the other members of the company passing on to Troas to await him there. The Philippians were the most loving and truehearted of the apostle’s converts, and during the eight days of the feast he enjoyed peaceful and happy communion with them."– {AA 390.4}



Brother Jason, are you saying Luke and Paul wasn't led by the Holy Spirit when they observed the Holy set days (all eight days) of GOD?



Blessings!
In the days of the apostles the most foolish heresies were presented as truth. History has been and will be repeated. There will always be those who, though apparently conscientious, will grasp at the shadow, preferring it to the substance. They take error in the place of truth, because error is clothed with a new garment, which they think covers something wonderful. But let the covering be removed, and nothingness appears (The Review and Herald, February 5, 1901). – {7BC 917.11}
Peace


True! But in no way is observing the Holy set days of GOD considered a foolish heresy. The Truth is they weren't done away with, You trying to make it done away without evidence isn't going to do. Now, would you like to answer the questions?


Blessings!
Paul was a Jew trying to win Jews.

Are the feast days shadows or not?

... There will always be those who, though apparently conscientious, will grasp at the shadow, preferring it to the substance...

Jason you should read your bible more...

Galatians 2:7But on the contrary, seeing that I had been entrusted with the gospel to the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been to the circumcised 8(for He who effectually worked for Peter in his apostleship to the circumcised effectually worked for me also to the Gentiles), 9and recognizing the grace that had been given to me, James and Cephas and John, who were reputed to be pillars, gave to me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship, so that we might go to the Gentiles and they to the circumcised.

Romans 11:12Now if their transgression is riches for the world and their failure is riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their fulfillment be! 13But I am speaking to you who are Gentiles. Inasmuch then as I am an apostle of Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14if somehow I might move to jealousy my fellow countrymen and save some of them.

Peace


Hi Gene, brother Jason reads the SOP found in the writings of EGW, something I know you don't agree with in many areas. But it talks about Pauls situations during the times of his ministry. Even though Paul was to preach to the Gentiles, he was Jewish, he had love for his brothers and sisters there, he tried to minister to them as well.



So what Jason is implying because he believes the Holy Feast days are ceremonial (and he can correct me if I'm wrong), is that because Paul observed the Holy set days of GOD that doesn't mean anything because he observed some ceremonial laws in order to preach to the Jews. It's a popular rebut, but we need to look at each circumstance and mind set and put the microscope on it, which SOP does, again Gene I know you don't cosign much of EGW writings, so this is for the SDA brothers and sisters.




EGW: "The apostle adapted himself to the customs and to the prejudices of those for whom he labored. This is illustrated by his course in the circumcision of timothy. Paul was at that time on a mission to the churches, carrying with him the decision of the council at jerusalem that this rite should not be urged upon the gentile converts. But when he decided to take with him timothy, whose father was a Greek, he “took and circumcised him because of the Jews which were in those quarters.” Acts 16:3. Had this not been done, he would have found no opportunity to preach the gospel to the jews, who were so zealous for the ceremonial law that at one time they sought to kill paul, merely because they thought he had taken a Greek into the temple." RH May 4,1911




Because the Jews we're so prejudice, zealous for the ceremonial law and was looking to kill Paul, he decided to have Timothy circumcised, so he didn't have to deal with all the drama so to speak. That's one circumstance.





EGW: "Later, under different circumstances, the same apostle wrote, “neither titus, who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised: and that because of false brethren unawares brought in, who came in privily to spy out our liberty which we have in Jesus Christ, that they might bring us into bondage.” Galatians 2:3, 4.
These two actions were not inconsistent. The mere act of circumcision was not in itself inherently wrong. “Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing.” Yet it was wrong to trust in this rite as a means of salvation; for this would make of no effect the grace of Christ. Galatians 5:4. On the other hand, it was right for one, where no divine principle was involved, to make a concession in this matter, to allay a prejudice among the Jews, in order that the gospel might be preached to them. The circumstances determined whether this action, indifferent in itself, was right or wrong." RH May 4, 1911




So the act of circumcision isn't wrong, as long as it doesn't involve a divine principle, then a concession could be made. But the only reason he had Timothy circumcised was because of those Jews who had some prejudice against him and wanted to kill him, and the main reason he's putting up with it in the first place is for the love of his brothers, to know the gospel of Jesus.


Another time, on his last journey, Paul observed the ceremonial law, for the same reason, for the love for his brothers, and keep the peace. These ceremonial laws that he engaged in wasn't right to do, it went against what GOD wanted, and instead quelling their anger and thrist to kill him, it just aroused it. SOP explains it





EGW: "The brethren hoped that Paul, by following the course suggested, might give a decisive contradiction to the false reports concerning him. They assured him that the decision of the former council concerning the Gentile converts and the ceremonial law, still held good. But the advice now given was not consistent with that decision. The Spirit of God did not prompt this instruction; it was the fruit of cowardice. The leaders of the church in Jerusalem knew that by non-conformity to the ceremonial law, Christians would bring upon themselves the hatred of the Jews and expose themselves to persecution. The Sanhedrin was doing its utmost to hinder the progress of the gospel. Men were chosen by this body to follow up the apostles, especially Paul, and in every possible way to oppose their work. Should the believers in Christ be condemned before the Sanhedrin as breakers of the law, they would suffer swift and severe punishment as apostates from the Jewish faith. {AA 404.1}
Many of the Jews who had accepted the gospel still cherished a regard for the ceremonial law and were only too willing to make unwise concessions, hoping thus to gain the confidence of their countrymen, to remove their prejudice, and to win them to faith in Christ as the world's Redeemer. Paul realized that so long as many of the leading members of the church at Jerusalem should continue to cherish prejudice against him, they would work constantly to counteract his influence. He felt that if by any reasonable concession he could win them to the truth he would remove a great obstacle to the success of the gospel in other places. But he was not authorized of God to concede as much as they asked. {AA 405.1}
When we think of Paul's great desire to be in harmony with his brethren, his tenderness toward the weak in the faith, his reverence for the apostles who had been with Christ, and for James, the brother of the Lord, and his purpose to become all things to all men so far as he could without sacrificing principle--when we think of all this, it is less surprising that he was constrained to deviate from the firm, decided course that he had hitherto followed. But instead of accomplishing the desired object, his efforts for conciliation only precipitated the crisis, hastened his predicted sufferings, and resulted in separating him from his brethren, depriving the church of one of its strongest pillars, and bringing sorrow to Christian hearts in every land. {AA 405.2}





EGW said, "He felt that if by any reasonable concession he could win them to the truth he would remove a great obstacle to the success of the gospel in other places. But he was not authorized of God to concede as much as they asked."


GOD did not authorized Paul actions here... So this was a different situation from having Timothy circumcised, the mere act wasn't wrong, but his acts described in AA on his last journey was wrong. However, let's keep in mind that the only reason he did that, to put up with the unrest, prejudice and hatered was for the love of his brothers.



Ok, let's go to a time of Paul's journey when there was no unrest, a peaceful time, a happy time. No pressure from Jews to observe something he didn't want to observe.



EGW: "At Philippi Paul tarried to keep the Passover. Only Luke remained with him, the other members of the company passing on to Troas to await him there. The Philippians were the most loving and truehearted of the apostle’s converts, and during the eight days of the feast he enjoyed peaceful and happy communion with them."– {AA 390.4}



In another place other than Jerusalem, in Philippi, Paul and Luke and converts observed GOD'S annual Holy set days, all eight days. Again, no pressure from no one, it was peaceful and happy time. Of their free will they observed GOD'S Holy Days.


Now, we can take this two ways, like you said brother Jason, to observe the ceremonial law would be to go against what GOD wants, against HIS Holy Spirit. So, should I believe Paul and Luke did that? That's is if you believe GOD'S Holy set days are ceremonial.


Well... I don't believe that, there is nothing saying the Holy set days that they are observing were wrong to observe.
Are you telling me The men who GOD used to preach the gospel, who taught the ceremonial law was done away with, of their on free will, was observing the ceremonial law?

I don't see that, I think they made it their business to observe GOD'S Holy set days in Philippi, if it didn't mean anything they would have kept it moving or kept GOD Holy days, but they observed all eight days.
The SOP shines light on what they were doing in Philippi. The Bible says they sailed away after the days of unleavened bread, but SOP tells us that observed the eight days of GOD annual Holy days.


It's not ceremonial, having a Holy Convocations on the days GOD says to is moral. Paul and Luke knew that, it was good times, as GOD Holy days should be and are meant to be.


Brother trust me bro, I wasn't always a Sabbath believer, and I use to try to poke holds in the teaching, but I came to find out it was Truth because of the evidence. Same with HIS annual Holy days, there is solid evidence proving they weren't done away with.

Brother Jason, I believe the way we observe GOD'S days now compared to how we will be observing it during the Loud Cry and in Heaven and the new earth respectively is a shadow on how it will be. The ceremonies that were done on those days pointed to Jesus and the Cross, it was a shadow till Jesus' death and resurrection.

The Feast days like Tabernacles has a future fulfillment (Zechariah.14)



EGW: "The Feast of Tabernacles was not only commemorative but typical. It not only pointed back to the wilderness sojourn, but, as the feast of harvest, it celebrated the ingathering of the fruits of the earth, and pointed forward to the great day of final ingathering, when the Lord of the harvest shall send forth His reapers to gather the tares together in bundles for the fire, and to gather the wheat into His garner. PP p.541



EGW: "In like manner the types which relate to the second advent must be fulfilled at the time pointed out in the symbolic"



As GOD has always done in the past, in the future, HE will use HIS appointed set times in relation to the second coming of Jesus.



Blessings! :)

Nicely presented Reasoning Blessing to you.... I agree the Feasts of Jesus are ceremonial but they were never abolished as Paul and the early disciples show us in Acts, and they were not just old Jews getting over a habit or tradition, they were keeping the Love feasts of Jesus as SOP calls them for a reason...pity SDA people don't see this, or the reason for the Love Feasts, we need to be practicing them more than ever, every month too....until Jesus comes

The unleaven feast, doing with less not more

The Tabernacle feast, learning to live on Jesus in the bush with no mod cons....

Shalom

Peace


Rob: "Nicely presented Reasoning Blessing to you.... I agree the Feasts of Jesus are ceremonial but they were never abolished as Paul and the early disciples show us in Acts, and they were not just old Jews getting over a habit or tradition, they were keeping the Love feasts of Jesus as SOP calls them for a reason..."




Hey Rob, Thank you... but I never said the annual Holy Feast Days of GOD were ceremonial, I said they are moral... Holy Convocations are moral. To come together and worship GOD on the days HE said to come is moral. That's why we see Paul, Luke and the converts observing HIS Holy set days.


Blessings!
Why church do not emcouraje us to observe ?

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