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Male Adventist Pastors Forgo Ordination Credentials in Solidarity with Unordained Women


I am honored to say that my pastor was one of those who turned in his Ordination credentials for Commissioned...In addition two Unions have suspended ordination altogether.


http://www.religionnews.com/2015/10/15/male-adventist-pastors-forgo...

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I hope you understand what you are saying here Pastor. If there is a law which says that women cannot be ordained or be head over the family or head over the  church family, would the spirit of the law say that she can be ordained or be head in spiritual matters? 

you gave 1, 2, 3 or first, second, third but no bible backing. Does your personal observation overrides the bible? 

Good question Jason....

Pastor T.,

Proverbs 3:5

Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. 

(Your personal observations are immaterial when God has been explicit on a matter!)

Proverbs 3:7

Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD......

This is what scriptures say regarding women;

1 Tim 2:12 - 13

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

13For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

1 Cor. 14:33-38

33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

34Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.

35And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

36What? came the word of God out from you? or came it unto you only?

37If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.

38But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant.

When such explicit instruction is given in the inspired, how did you get to the stage of debating the ordination of women as pastors and elders????? 

Like Huldah or Deborah, right?

You say:Here is my personal observation:

I say: Wow

What of Ephesians 5:25?  What your saying kind of makes the love story of Christ and His church null and void does it not?  

incredible statement.  I hope you can explain.  

Ephesians 5:22-28

22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

24Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

This is what the bible teaches - not a marriage of business partners...

Peace


Sarah:"In addition two Unions have suspended ordination altogether"



Blessings sister Sarah, how have you been, I pray all is well...


This is good, not because it's in protest of women not being ordained, but it proves ordination by human hands doesn't mean anything in regards to functioning a church. Remove it and the problem is gone. I wrote that back in 2013, brother Martein actually started a new thread on what I said, it's called ban ordination all together. Don't just suspend ordination, ban it!!!!

It removes this distraction hot button issue from the church... and we can take that energy and use it for what GOD has truly ordained us to do, because HE is the only ONE Who can ordain. Having a ceremony acknowledging a person fruits in the field that GOD has ordain them to be in is great... from talking to you in the past Sarah it's something your church does... My thing is if any church thinks, if any man or women thinks the laying on hands ceremony by men is a special privilege or a right of passage for the title of being ordain then their wrong.

Why do we crave it so bad, is it about money? Is it the title/ position? Tax purposes? what??




EGW: "Both Paul and Barnabas had already received their commission from God Himself, and the ceremony of the laying on of hands added no new grace or virtual qualification."


EGW: "At a later date, the rite of ordination by the laying on of hands was greatly abused; unwarrantable importance was attached to the act, as if a power came at once upon those who received such ordination, which immediately qualified them for any and all ministerial work. But in the setting apart of these two apostles, there is no record indicating that any virtue was imparted by the mere act of laying on of hands." —GW p.442



GOD decides where we work in HIS vineyard, HE ordains... There are so called ordained pastors that shouldn't even be pastors, they are unfit for a position that they crave for...




EGW: "There are some who are adapted to the work of the colporteur and who can accomplish more in this line than by preaching. If the Spirit of Christ dwells in their hearts, they will find opportunity to present His word to others and to direct minds to the special truths for this time. Men suited to this work undertake it; but some injudicious minister flatters them that their gifts should be employed in preaching instead of in the work of the colporteur.Thus they are influenced to get a license to preach, and the very ones who might have been trained to make good missionaries to visit families at their homes, to talk and pray with them, are turned away from a work for which they are fitted, to make poor ministers, and the field where so much labor is needed and where so much good might be accomplished is neglected."




Only license we need is from the Holy Spirit, and letting Him lead us to the place we need to be within the Church, He's going to use people who can talk to large amount people, He's going use people who can speak knee cap to knee cap, He's going to use singers and musicians, old people, young people, etc. All working for the same cause, all being ordained by the Holy Spirit.

My sisters you want to be a pastor, you feel that's your calling, forget about the paper work and the laying on hands of humans and just go out and pastor.




EGW: "All who desire an opportunity for true ministry, and who will give themselves unreservedly to God, will find in the canvassing work opportunities to speak upon many things pertaining to the future, immortal life. The experience thus gained will be of the greatest value to those who are fitting themselves for the ministry. It is the accompaniment of the Holy Spirit of God that prepares workers, both men and women, to become pastors to the flock of God. As they cherish the thought that Christ is their Companion, a holy awe, a sacred joy, will be felt by them amid all their trying experiences and all their tests. They will learn how to pray as they work. They will be educated in patience, kindness, affability, and helpfulness. They will practice true Christian courtesy, bearing in mind that Christ, their Companion, cannot approve of harsh, unkind words or feelings. Their words will be purified. The power of speech will be regarded as a precious talent, lent them to do a high and holy work. The human agent will learn how to represent the divine Companion with whom he is associated. To that unseen Holy One he will show respect and reverence because he is wearing His yoke and is learning His pure, holy ways. Those who have faith in this divine Attendant will develop. They will be gifted with power to clothe the message of truth with a sacred beauty."




Ban ordination credentials, let our credentials come from GOD and let his Holy Spirit guide us to where HE wants us to be and what work HE wants us to do. If being a pastor is your calling don't look for degrees and the approval of men with the laying on of hands to give you a stamp of approval in being ordained. The males who gave up their man made ordaintion credentials hasn't given up anything, I'm sure their still fulfilling their duties as a pastor, still teaching.


Ban ordination altogether!!! Who's with me..........!!!!!! (Lol... Sound of crickets) :-/


Blessings! :)

CORRECTION:  Two Divisions have suspended ordination, by majority votes. 

Peace


Sarah : " CORRECTION: Two Divisions have suspended ordination, by majority votes. "


Oh ok, but that doesn't change my view, without this issue there's no going back and forth and it being use to bring confusion and disrupt. I understand the push for having women ordained, like it's an injustice going on... I believe the system has taken on a spirit of its own, and the mindset of being ordained is wrong.

I believe women are ordained by the Holy Spirit to pastor, a person fruits is the proof. Do you need paper work? No... There are women in many SDA church's that are running the show so to speak, making sure things function properly, they teach lessons to the people, just like EGW taught the SDA Church lessons by the guidance of the Holy Spirit, she's more ordained than most of our so called ordained pastors.



EGW: "At a later date, the rite of ordination by the laying on of hands was greatly abused; unwarrantable importance was attached to the act, as if a power came at once upon those who received such ordination, which immediately qualified them for any and all ministerial work. But in the setting apart of these two apostles, there is no record indicating that any virtue was imparted by the mere act of laying on of hands." —GW p.442



With Tares still mingled in the SDA Church should we believe abuses aren't taken place, should I assume there's no unwarranted importance attach to the act of laying on hands of men to approve them and give them the title of 'ordained' pastor?

it's something we can do without, it'll do away with this hot contentious issue... Imagine that!


Blessings!!


P.S what else does these men give up in these two divisions sister Sarah? Besides giving up the credentials of being ordained,, does that take away their pay, what fuctions as an ordained pastor for a church do they give up? Thank you!!


Hi Sarah, Ok, I just found the answer in the article... It said,


" there is no pay difference between ordained and commissioned pastors."


"Mike Speegle, senior pastor of an Adventist church in Fulton, Md., said Wednesday (Oct. 14) that he requested and received a change in his credentials late this summer as his way of supporting his female colleagues."

“In our structure, I can’t make them equal with me by ordaining them, but I can make myself equal with them by taking the commissioned license, which is exactly what they have,” he said."



Pastor Kymone Hinds, the leader of a Memphis, Tenn., church, took similar action. He and another minister, Pastor Furman Fordham of Nashville, Tenn., received permission from their regional officials.

“Though I am not in agreement with the position that you brethren have taken on this issue, I admire your willingness to act on your convictions and fully support your right to do so,” wrote Elder D.C. Edmond, president of the denomination’s South Central Conference, in a September letter to them.

Hinds said it was worth it to him to lose access to certain privileges of ordination: presiding over regional conferences; organizing churches; and ordaining elders, deacons or deaconesses"


If everybody handed in the credentials then someone still has to perform those functions, does the Church stop because of it? I doubt it.


Bless!





No on is trying to change your view. :)  Just presenting the facts--and once again, the Men are leading this--you know, those who you may believe only should be leaders.  God is Good. 

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