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In a recent discussion with a disgruntled Adventist, I was told that many in the church treat Ellen White like the Catholics treat the Virgin Mary...

It made me think... Could it be that some hold the same view?

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The problem with most of the critics is they are more full of error thus have no credibility.

At the time SDA began all the Christians were historicist (as known today). Some of this is found in SDA still while most of Christianity has lost this. It is historicism that is the true faith of Jesus or reading of the Bible.

There were so many historicist often with their own brand evident by the many Bible commentaries of the time to then have someone come along and claim God showed truth (Thus saith the Lord) in all things to guide them in historicim was common.

Sola Scriptura.


The problem with most of the critics is they are more full of error thus have no credibility.

Yes, this is a serious problem but it is not the worst problem in this matter or any other serious matter that comes up before this denomination.  I'm going to go out on a bit of a limb here because I have only read a couple of Fords articles and all the rest I know of what he said is hearsay from my religion and theology classes, teachers and classmates, but my own intense study over the last 13 years has lead me to many of the same conclusions, and from Bible study alone. 

Ford had considerable evidence and considerable credibility.  Those theologians I referred to above all found his material convincing, but were not entirely convinced yet themselves.  Most remained unconvinced until the Glacier View Conference decided the matter for them.  (To a man (and woman) they toed the official denomination line and completely rejected all the work of Ford.)  I was convinced.  I was convinced he was a quack, but then I had never read any of his stuff, nor had I ever studied any of those matters in scripture with enough depth and detail to have any clue why even the founders believed what they did, and certainly not in enough detail to know how many of their own prophecy interpretation rules they broke.  I'm only beginning to see that from reading the writings of a few current teachers who in their efforts to support the fathers have provided more than enough evidence to convict them in any reasonable court.

Glacier View convinced me too, but the only thing it convinced me of was how strong the will not to believe, and how strong the refusal to properly investigate anything is in this denomination.  The rest of the church is not without blame in either of these areas either, but the full church is not my focus.  I only knew a few of the delegates to Glacier View.  They knew weeks before the conference what their vote was going to be.  I don't know how carefully any of them studied Ford's 1000 page treatise, but most of the delegates I knew had at least read it.  I knew several other people who knew delegates from other places including Africa and India.  The delegates from these places had neither read the treatise nor knew anything at all of Ford's theology, much less the controversy it had stirred in the academic community for years prior to Glacier View.  These people all went to Glacier View knowing how they would vote even though they knew nothing of the issue.  For that matter, even if the delegates were properly prepared three days is no where near enough time to adequately discuss the evidence provided in a 1000 page treatise, especially when it comes to discussing the matter of essentially invalidating a number of foundational doctrines for this denomination, including the nature (not the existence) of the New Covenant temple, the validity of the 2300 evenings and mornings prophecy interpretation, and the reliability of the testimony of Ellen White.

I continued to completely disagree with Ford for the next 15 years until God brought me to a situation where he could force me to examine these issues in depth from scripture on my own, but I also knew beyond any shadow of a doubt the miscarriage of justice that occurred at Glacier View and that this denomination has no regard for truth, only for not being placed in a position where they would have to say, "We were wrong."

There is no bigger problem than this in any matter, and it is seed daily on this forum.  Having not read Ford's work and compared it to scripture I still don't know how accurate any of it is.  I only know that what I have learned since comes very close to what I understood from hearsay evidence to be his beliefs in these matters, and I regularly prove from scriptures why I believe what I believe.  Few people will make any such effort.

There are problems in the historicist view of prophecy as well, but they are extremely minor as compared to what we see in any of the other common schools of interpretation.

Boy,  if my mom could read this thread, she would think my church is a loonie bin... Lol

 Is your mother of some kind of superior knowledge and wisdom ?  Satan is indeed causing confusion but this has been prophesied and is to be accepted. Satan certainly will not leave the true church alone.  It is not the church as a whole that will convince the people but the messages from the Word of God. To many people look at this or that or the other when they should be looking at God's Word.

Mirror, Mirror on the wall.

When are you going to start looking at the word of God instead of refusing to ever prove anything by it and condemning those who do?

 By the way I intended to say it is to be expected not accepted.


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