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In another thread, I suppose I SHOULDN'T even put this on here, but I'm looking for ex..., one of our sisters brought the question of a prophet and his truthfulness to the forum. There were some careful, some instant believer's comments and some full scale critics. The author herself stated: "I do and cannot say this is of God, I DO know it has happened very often since the first "vision", and is still happening. Someone please give me something I can understand."

I believe that God at all times through history and today has servants that fully give themselves to Him so that He may speak to individuals, the church or even mankind through them. We are also aware that Jesus personally emphasized the warning that false prophets will arise who will deceive many. (Matth. 24:11)

So I'd like to post a biblical way to test prophets. Ellen White had to "take" it and I believe it is in place for any one of our brothers and sisters who use the name of the Lord as a signature to their writings. The following is taken from one of Heinz Schaidinger's Bible studies (German language), a teacher from our Adventist seminary in Bogenhofen, Austria. I will try to update this if any of you find and post other key criteria.

Tasks and Testing of True Prophets

The tasks of a prophet of God is not alone to predict things to come but also to guide and lead (Hosea 12:13ff) and to bring the people of God to repent (Jeremiah 26: 1-15, 23:22).

  1. How to recognize a false prophet
    1. Jeremiah 6:14, Ezechiel 13:16, 2. Timothy 4:2ff : They say what people want to hear, not they should be hearing
    2. Micah 3:11, 1 Timothy 6:5, Titus 1:11: They are motivated by personal profit
    3. Isaiah 28:7, Jeremiah 23:14+32: The way they lead their life tempts people to sin
    4. Deuteronomy 13:1-5, 18:20: They lead the people away from God and not to Him
  2. How to recognize a true prophet
    1. Matthew 7:15-20: By their fruits you shall recognize them...
    2. Isaiah 8:20, Romans 12:7, 1 Corinthians 14:32, Galatians 1:8ff: There must not be any contradiction between a prophet's message and any past revelation of God. Jeremiah 26:16-19 illustrates this, also 1 Thessalonians5:19ff.
    3. Jeremiah 28:9, 18:7-10, Deuteronomy 13:1-5: Prophecies must come true - but they may be conditional, such as Jonah 3:10, 1 Samuel 2:29, Isaiah 2:2-5. These prophecies never came true and yet Jonah, Moses and Isaiah were no false prophets. The conditions or requirements for the prophecy were not met. Also there may be false prophets whose predictions do come true. These then need to be recognized by their message.
    4. 1 John 4:1ff: Jesus must be at the heart of their message.
    5. Jeremiah 23:16-22: A true prophet does not present a gentle and slumberous "gospel" but rather a clear call to repentance. Who would dare to quiet the voice of the Lord?
    6. Deuteronomy 18:15, Numbers 12:3: Moses was humble. A real sign of a true prophet is that he is not vain or proud. These verses show how every future prophet will be tested against Moses.

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Heb 1:1-2 tells us that Jesus is the last prophet.  (Sorry.  I know this is offensive to many.)

Nope, does not say that at all.

 

  In my opinion Jesus did not need another prophet

Jesus is God - and God wouldn't need any man, woman, prophet or anything before or after coming into the world because He is God. But he wanted to.

 

and never said there would be one.  And there is not one.

John wrote the prophetic book of Revelation - are you saying it is false?

Peter applied the prophecy of Joel 3:1-5 to a time after Jesus - was he wrong?

And Paul wrote at length about the gift of prophecy - why would he do that if there were no more prophets?

Why would John tell us to test the spirits if he could have said: Don't trust anyone!

And prophecy's intention is to give guidance, instruction in pivotal times or tell God's people things to come. It is not the purpose to write a new bible.

Randy, perhaps you can see that it is as it reads but notice when the writer of Hebrews was speaking.  It was in the days shortly after Jesus died.  In fact it was Jesus Himself that spoke in "these last days".  The writer to the Hebrews was speaking of the time they were in.  He is also addressing the Hebrews to know that Jesus is in fact the Son of God and His message was to be heeded by them as He was their creator and heir of all things.

Hey Randy, I just want to clarify something you said and please correct me if I am wrong.  You said:

"In these last days, He speaks to us through His Son."

The Bible says:

"in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son"

Let's take a look at the grammar used when using the words "these last days"...

"For these last 30 days I've not been summoned to come to the king..."

"...but he has now revealed him to you in these last days."

"You have stored up treasures in these last days."

It appears that Jesus was the chosen vessel to reveal God's will to His people in the days in which Peter spoke at least is appears so above.  I have not done an exegesis on the Hebrew and Greek but by taking a quick look, this is how it appears to be.

With that being said, if it is as you say that there would be no prophets after Jesus, it does not seem to be the case for Joel speaks of True prophets arising in THE END.  If you have time, please read Joel 2:28-31 and let me know what you see,

Hello Everyone.

My name is Desire,and I'm new here.  But, several of us have been monitoring the conversions between people, concerning Rickey and Joyce Roden

We here are all baptized members of the SDA church. And we have a request. The Roden's accounts  have been "Frozen", and many things have, both true and false have been said about them now  that they are unable to responsd to certain accusations.

What if they are wanting to to apologize? Or speak to others about possible misunderstantings? We as members of the SDA church humbly ask  that Mr Clark P. unfreeze their accounts so they may speak for themselves in response to possable misunderstandings.

Yes, we are aware of the things the Rodens have done that some feel were wrong, but we need to forgive. As Christ forgave, so we should be like him.

Mr. Clark P, please, for the sake of Jesus, we ask that you un-freeze the accounts of Rickey and Joyce Roden.I won't be on here for very long, but we felt that it was necessary for this letter to be sent. We would like to hear more from them before we share our  humble opinions.

Thank you.

May God bless. 

Agree with Ron totally.

desire b said:

Hello Everyone.

My name is Desire,and I'm new here.  But, several of us have been monitoring the conversions between people, concerning Rickey and Joyce Roden

We here are all baptized members of the SDA church. And we have a request. The Roden's accounts  have been "Frozen", and many things have, both true and false have been said about them now  that they are unable to responsd to certain accusations.

What if they are wanting to to apologize? Or speak to others about possible misunderstantings? We as members of the SDA church humbly ask  that Mr Clark P. unfreeze their accounts so they may speak for themselves in response to possable misunderstandings.

Yes, we are aware of the things the Rodens have done that some feel were wrong, but we need to forgive. As Christ forgave, so we should be like him.

Mr. Clark P, please, for the sake of Jesus, we ask that you un-freeze the accounts of Rickey and Joyce Roden.I won't be on here for very long, but we felt that it was necessary for this letter to be sent. We would like to hear more from them before we share our  humble opinions.

Thank you.

May God bless. 

Greetings desire,

We would accept any apology offered by the Roden's.  We forgive as Christ forgave and have already forgiven them.  We wish that they experience God's grace and hope to see them in Heaven.  But Adventist Online is not the place for them.  Their behavior here was not appropriate.  They willfully broke multiple site rules.  They had five accounts between them.  You could possibly be the sixth.  Both of them, on separate occasions, have threatened me personally.  This is not behavior we accept on Adventist Online.

As for "monitoring the conversations", I don't see how you could possibly do that.  The Roden's have attempted to delete every negative thing they have said here.  Reading the resulting discussions after they have deleted their comments does not give a true picture of their behavior here.

We can do nothing to stop you from hearing more from them.  You live in the same town as them and can be in contact with them all you wish.  You clearly know and have heard their story from them as you have revealed information that only Rickey, Joyce, and Adventist Online moderators knew.  We pray that you support them in this difficult time.

We welcome your humble opinions on this matter.

Blessings and prayers,
Clark P

This is so true and I agree.   Clark you did the right thing, God's way with love and patience.  You have our full unconditional support in AO  and we pray for you.   God bless.

The most important lesson for me is realizing my own personality trait of "hearing what I want to hear and disregard the rest."

Welcome to life as a sinful human!  ;-)  We all do this to some extent.  It is my constant prayer to be led to God's truth and not what I want to hear.

Blessings and prayers,
/Clark

Hear the words of God. The Lord has said:

    The prophets that I will choose in the last days will walk and live among others. And they will be common, ordinary people.

     They will be people who are called to apostolic positions, and are given a people to guide to redemption.

     Theirs is the responsibility to lead those people, by my words, in such a way that they win the battles of life and conquer the ordinary temptations and passions and challenges.

     And it shall be as though these Prophets are tapped on the shoulder and reminded: "While they carry such responsibility to help others with their battles, they are not excused from their own challenges of life. They too will be subject to passions, temptations, challenges.

     Some people will, somehow, be dissatisfied to find the leading servants of the Lord to be such ordinary mortals.

     And there shall be many who will be disappointed that there is not some obvious mystery about these people, and it will be almost as if they are looking for the strange and the occult.

     For those who hear my words through the Prophets however, it should be as a great testimony that the prophets of old and the prophets today are called out from the ranks of ordinary men. And it should not lessen their faith.

    For those who persecute them for the gift they have been given. And in their idea of testing the spirits is to do no more than seek to find fault in them, I tell you that they have shown nothing to me but ignorance and haudyness.

     Rather, they would do well to learn that Elijah was discouraged at times, even despondent (1 Kings 19:4). Noah occasionally drank wine to the point of drunkenness and unconsciousness (Genesis 9:21, 23). Abraham acquiesced in his wife's mistreatment of his second wife (Genesis 16:6). Jacob "with subtlety" and deception obtained his brother's blessing from his blind father Isaac (Genesis 27:12, 35), and also hated his first wife Leah (Genesis 29:30-31). Moses at the least committed manslaughter prior to his call as a prophet (Exodus 2:12-14), and after that call occasionally exhibited doubt in God's word, fierce anger, and boastful arrogance (Exodus 4:10-14, 5:22-23, 32:19; Numbers 20:10-12). The Lord had to intervene directly to prevent Samuel from choosing the wrong man as king (1 Samuel 16:6-7). Daniel sought forgiveness for his sins while prophet (Daniel 9:20). Jonah resisted the commandment of God to him (Jonah 1:2-3, 4:1) James and John, as apostles, delighted in the thought of their opponents being destroyed (Luke 9:52-56) and pridefully sought to elevate themselves above the rest of God's children in the eternities (Mark 10:35-38). Peter was impudent, boastful, arrogant, and cowardly as an apostle during the life of Jesus (Matthew 16:21-23, 26:69-75; John 13:8-9, 18:10-11). Despite Christ's command to send the Gospel to all nations at His ascension (Matthew 27:19; Mark 16:15; Luke 24:47), it required another specific revelation to Peter to persuade him that the Gospel should be taken to those who were not Jews (Acts 10-11), and even years after that revelation Peter continued to demonstrate his prejudice (Galatians 2:1,9,11-14). Nor did Peter hesitate to criticize the approach of his fellow apostle Paul in teaching the Gospel (2 Peter 3:15-16); Paul likewise boasted that he had publicly condemned Peter and "withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed" (Galatians 2:11-14). Moreover, conflicts between Barnabus and Paul resulted in the disruption of their mission (Acts 13:2, 15:36-39)."

desire b said:

Hear the words of God. The Lord has said:

    The prophets that I will choose in the last days will walk and live among others. And they will be common, ordinary people.

     They will be people who are called to apostolic positions, and are given a people to guide to redemption.

     Theirs is the responsibility to lead those people, by my words, in such a way that they win the battles of life and conquer the ordinary temptations and passions and challenges.

     And it shall be as though these Prophets are tapped on the shoulder and reminded: "While they carry such responsibility to help others with their battles, they are not excused from their own challenges of life. They too will be subject to passions, temptations, challenges.

     Some people will, somehow, be dissatisfied to find the leading servants of the Lord to be such ordinary mortals.

     And there shall be many who will be disappointed that there is not some obvious mystery about these people, and it will be almost as if they are looking for the strange and the occult.

     For those who hear my words through the Prophets however, it should be as a great testimony that the prophets of old and the prophets today are called out from the ranks of ordinary men. And it should not lessen their faith.

    For those who persecute them for the gift they have been given. And in their idea of testing the spirits is to do no more than seek to find fault in them, I tell you that they have shown nothing to me but ignorance and haudyness.

     Rather, they would do well to learn that Elijah was discouraged at times, even despondent (1 Kings 19:4). Noah occasionally drank wine to the point of drunkenness and unconsciousness (Genesis 9:21, 23). Abraham acquiesced in his wife's mistreatment of his second wife (Genesis 16:6). Jacob "with subtlety" and deception obtained his brother's blessing from his blind father Isaac (Genesis 27:12, 35), and also hated his first wife Leah (Genesis 29:30-31). Moses at the least committed manslaughter prior to his call as a prophet (Exodus 2:12-14), and after that call occasionally exhibited doubt in God's word, fierce anger, and boastful arrogance (Exodus 4:10-14, 5:22-23, 32:19; Numbers 20:10-12). The Lord had to intervene directly to prevent Samuel from choosing the wrong man as king (1 Samuel 16:6-7). Daniel sought forgiveness for his sins while prophet (Daniel 9:20). Jonah resisted the commandment of God to him (Jonah 1:2-3, 4:1) James and John, as apostles, delighted in the thought of their opponents being destroyed (Luke 9:52-56) and pridefully sought to elevate themselves above the rest of God's children in the eternities (Mark 10:35-38). Peter was impudent, boastful, arrogant, and cowardly as an apostle during the life of Jesus (Matthew 16:21-23, 26:69-75; John 13:8-9, 18:10-11). Despite Christ's command to send the Gospel to all nations at His ascension (Matthew 27:19; Mark 16:15; Luke 24:47), it required another specific revelation to Peter to persuade him that the Gospel should be taken to those who were not Jews (Acts 10-11), and even years after that revelation Peter continued to demonstrate his prejudice (Galatians 2:1,9,11-14). Nor did Peter hesitate to criticize the approach of his fellow apostle Paul in teaching the Gospel (2 Peter 3:15-16); Paul likewise boasted that he had publicly condemned Peter and "withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed" (Galatians 2:11-14). Moreover, conflicts between Barnabus and Paul resulted in the disruption of their mission (Acts 13:2, 15:36-39)."

Greetings desire!

Can you give us the source of this message?  Thank you.

Blessings and prayers,
Clark

Thank you for that link Reya.  (link)

Well this lays to rest the inspired nature of these "prophesies."  Blatant plagiarism after claiming "Hear the words of God. The Lord has said:" is a sin against God and intentional deception of fellow believers.

Compare the above with the source writings they were copied from by two presidents of the Mormon church:

President Boyd K. Packer taught:

"The prophets, as they walk and live among men, are common, ordinary men. Men called to apostolic positions are given a people to redeem. Theirs is the responsibility to lead those people in such a way that they win the battles of life and conquer the ordinary temptations and passions and challenges. And then, speaking figuratively, it is as though these prophets are tapped on the shoulder and reminded: "While you carry such responsibility to help others with their battles, you are not excused from your own challenges of life. You too will be subject to passions, temptations, challenges. Win those battles as best you can.  Some people are somehow dissatisfied to find in the leading servants of the Lord such ordinary mortals. They are disappointed that there is not some obvious mystery about those men; it is almost as if they are looking for the strange and the occult. To me, however, it is a great testimony that the prophets anciently and the prophets today are called out from the ranks of the ordinary men. It should not lessen our faith, for example, to learn that Elijah was discouraged at times, even despondent. (See 1Kgs.19:4.) This calling forth of ordinary men for extraordinary purposes is as evident during the Savior's earthly mission as in former and later eras." (The Holy Temple, p. 102)

Combined with the writing of another Mormon president (President Charles W. Penrose)

"Noah occasionally drank wine to the point of drunkenness and unconsciousness (Genesis 9:21, 23). Abraham acquiesced in his wife's mistreatment of his second wife (Genesis 16:6). Jacob "with subtlety" and deception obtained his brother's blessing from his blind father Isaac (Genesis 27:12, 35), and also hated his first wife Leah (Genesis 29:30-31). Moses at the least committed manslaughter prior to his call as a prophet (Exodus 2:12-14), and after that call occasionally exhibited doubt in God's word, fierce anger, and boastful arrogance (Exodus 4:10-14, 5:22-23, 32:19; Numbers 20:10-12). The Lord had to intervene directly to prevent Samuel from choosing the wrong man as king (1 Samuel 16:6-7). Daniel sought forgiveness for his sins while prophet (Daniel 9:20). Jonah resisted the commandment of God to him (Jonah 1:2-3, 4:1) James and John, as apostles, delighted in the thought of their opponents being destroyed (Luke 9:52-56) and pridefully sought to elevate themselves above the rest of God's children in the eternities (Mark 10:35-38). Peter was impudent, boastful, arrogant, and cowardly as an apostle during the life of Jesus (Matthew 16:21-23, 26:69-75; John 13:8-9, 18:10-11). Despite Christ's command to send the Gospel to all nations at His ascension (Matthew 27:19; Mark 16:15; Luke 24:47), it required another specific revelation to Peter to persuade him that the Gospel should be taken to those who were not Jews (Acts 10-11), and even years after that revelation Peter continued to demonstrate his prejudice (Galatians 2:1,9,11-14). Nor did Peter hesitate to criticize the approach of his fellow apostle Paul in teaching the Gospel (2 Peter 3:15-16); Paul likewise boasted that he had publicly condemned Peter and "withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed" (Galatians 2:11-14). Moreover, conflicts between Barnabus and Paul resulted in the disruption of their mission (Acts 13:2, 15:36-39)."

May we always seek Him as we study and learn.

Blessings and prayers,
Clark

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