Not trying to bring politics into the forum. But I just cant help to see how these laws which seem beneficial and harmless, are but pushing us closer to the national sunday law.
And remember that you can get subsidies if your income for two is less than $62,000. Sure the insurance may be expensive and no one wants to pay more taxes. However there is no dilemma that exists as to whether you will "break the law". Get the insurance or don't, but you will in no way be breaking the law.
@ Jill,I am impressed with your generosity. From the sounds of it, it sounds like you would be as generous in helping the ministries as well.
Your argument does make a lot of sense,for those who do need the coverage for serious health reasons,and certainly,in that case it would be worth paying taxes to help those in need. However,just as donating to a ministry is voluntary, Im sure the majority would want this to be voluntary as well.
However you seem to be missing a few facts....
1.) Since the ACA has changed most policy criteria and raised over all price in the industry one gets turned down for private healthcare far more easily, leaving them no option, but to get coverage from the government.
2.) I have personally read the bill, and when you sign on with ACA you are not just getting coverage, but giving up many basic freedoms.. If I for example were to sign up for it they would automatically assign a case worker (much like those used with CPS) that is free to come to my home unannounced and uninvited and his/her discretion. And since veganisum is not the government approved diet, they would have the right to charge me with child neglect and take my kids. Same thing with teaching that Christ is the only way, because by the government standard we are to teach our children all religions/gods are equal.
3.) No one wouldn't be considered breaking the law, but rather forced to pay increasing fines every year (With no limit what so ever on how many years it will be raised for.), until one is basically spending thousands a year. On top of the taxes that we already have taken out of our checks for Medicare / Medicaid.
Basically the system is designed to eventually drive those who will not cooperate in to poverty.
here is an example of what our state spent MILLIONS on to get people to buy! https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Xv2UUcX...
I understand your pain. That is the cry of every American lately. It is no wonder why so many Americans are leaving the US. These laws are changing very rapid,and that is just a sign of the end times. We must pray for one another for these difficult times ahead.
@Manuela, in case you didn't know, such things are not required in the islands. That's why as I stated before, many Americans are leaving the US, like to the caribean islands where there aren't many requirements of health insurance and perhaps even taxes.
Many other countries may require health insurance, and I believe they may be free.
Will answer here quick Zowi and Daughter:
1) I was replying to your statement where you assumed that "everyone" outside of the US is not forced to buy health coverage.
Most countries do force you.
2) For the "free" argument: Actually thats quite wrong. In most of Europe as example you pay between 12 and 35% of your income automatically into the healthcare system and you are entered automatically into these systems with no chance to opt out. Some countries like Austria have it split between the employer and the employee. Meaning in Austria 17,5% of your income before taxes is taken into the healthcare system and the employer has to pay the same amount into the system.
So not really "free" after all just automatically paid and percentage based.
3) Insurances in general are always some kind of "leveling the playing field". If nothing hapens you could have safed x amount but in case something happens your happy to have it. Sure a broken bone every 10 year might be cheaper to pay by yourself. What if one has a car accident and needs emergency surgeries? Those would end up quite a bill.
4) I do not know the Health System in the US in detail however isnt it bad for a society in general when 10% (guessed number) of the population is uninsured? Or when a Healthcare System of the most advanced state ranks at place 37 in comparisons?
I do not know if Obamacare is the solution or if its a good one or if there would be better ones but that something should be done when millions of people in a state are uninsured i agree with in general.
The Dutch have an obligatory health insurance system.
In "some cases" it can be of some benefit. @Jill, especially if they are providing it for their people at lower cost.
You seem to miss the point.
It is not "lower cost" or cheaper at all.
Gross income in Austria as example is somewhat 3800 € / Month.
Since there is an obligatory social security system the government takes away roughly 650 € / Month from that.
Furthermore the employer has to pay an equal sum into the social security system system.
So you end up with 1300 € / Month being paid for social security system.
Around 60% of this is transferred into the health care system the rest distributed to unemployment insurance, pension system, welfare system etc.
So average employee "pays" arround 800 € / Month for health care insurance. Sums up to nearly 10.000 € / year (13,765 USD / year).
Unlike in other countries everyone is insured. If they do not work or do not pay the health plan (if you dont receive enough gross income) their costs are carried through tax system and through others who pay more etc.
In general it is not "cheap" or "free" it is just obligatory and it is in most cases "invisible" payment by the population since most only care the net income.
Furthermore people have the option to opt in into a premium private healthcare insurance as well.
Only because its obligatory does not mean it is "free" or "lower cost" or paid by state.
The european background is just somewhat different from the US. People here complain about the health care system and how bad it is etc but nearly nobody even questions the need for an universal health care system which covers everyone, no matter their income, with healthcare.
In general the comparisons between the healthcare system and healthcare costs of countries show that the european systems rank better than the US system as example.
For individuals who have a high income a system like the US has is probably "better" for the general population the same can not be said.
@Manuela, But if I seem to miss the point,so does the entire nation. Explain that to them...
Was referring to the statement "lower cost" or "free" in states which run obligatory insurances.
If you do the math you end up at way higher costs per individual than you pay for a premium coverage in the US.
for the "entire nation" part:
Around 40% support the ACA at the moment it seems regarding to CNN.
Maybe at the moment the majority opposes yes but surely not the entire nation.