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..or those who question why God doesn't save everyone.

The wrong premise that comes with Universalism, is that the wicked will die is not true because it would then be a limitation in God, it holds that if all are not saved, it limits God and His ability to heal all sin. It really is failure on their part to realize that God cannot create character. God can create sinless beings, but the character must be developed by the freewill choices of the person. While God does possess the power to overwrite the individuality of a person and instill His perfection without their consent, to do so would destroy that person and create a basically a robot, where that person used to be. This action would violate God’s own character of love, which never compels, never coerces, and never forces. Love only exists in an atmosphere of freedom. So the Universalist idea, that God’s love will one day be so compelling that all will be overwhelmed and become godly, actually presents a God who is not love, but rather a dictator who forces everyone to be like Him. Genuine love, as painful as it is, allows the rejection of love.

The next idea that is problem in Universalism, is that forgiveness solves the sin problem. If sin is the breaking of rules and requires punishment, but Jesus paid the punishment, then wouldn’t God forgive everyone? And if God forgives everyone, won’t all be saved?

The argument is that there is no limit to God’s forgiveness; therefore, all are forgiven and so all will be saved. While it is true that God’s forgiveness is limitless and that He forgives everyone, forgiveness does not equal salvation.  For Universalists, if a person is pardoned, he or she is freed from the punishment of the law and since God forgives everyone, then everyone must be saved. But the reality we find is that while you can forgive a person for overdosing on drugs, the forgiveness doesn’t prevent the damage done and the user still dies.

Jesus forgave those who crucified Him, but the evidence shows that many were not changed by that forgiveness. They remained selfish, and full of iniquity and within their hearts still hated truth and love. Thus, if God would take them to heaven anyway, it would be a place of torture to them, as they by their choices, have rejected love and truth and developed selfish characters that will not find God’s unveiled infinite love and truth enjoyable, they rather flee from God, begging to have the mountains crush them to hide them from Him.

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Gene said;

"[Question, when will they reign on earth, and when will they be a kingdom of priests?]"

Yes, Gen good question and the answer will be found when you reconcile the texts on this subject as the true SDA students have. They did not build a doctrine on one text like you like to do. As Benicio says your gospel is generic and more precisely a second chance gospel that SDA does not subscribe to what so ever. 

He doesn't. God doesn't need anything.

His people will be a kingdom of priests because with the eradication of sin there will be no need to work like before, no more hard, sweat-inducing work. Rather, we will spend our time with God.

We will be restored to the position that Adam was in before the fall. The earth will be made new, as will we. The only ones who have salvation are those who spend one thousand years with Christ in heaven before returning to the new earth and a new life. 

JohnB,

We know God does need, but through Jesus Christ the bible says he has made those who are to be resurrected first into a kingdom of priest.

Revelation 5:10 New International Version says, “You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God”, while other say unto God or for God.

So, God has a designed purpose for those who are resurrected first.  You have a fairy-tale view of this, one that is not rooted in scripture.

Those who are given salvation first will reign with Christ for a thousand years serving as kings and priests unto God.

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

You should understand what this word “reign” means in this context; it means to rule or to be king.

Some bibles make this distinction;

  • but they shall be priests to God and to Christ, and shall be kings with Christ for the thousand years. (Weymouth New Testament)
  • They will continue to be priests of God and Christ. They will rule with him for 1,000 years. (GOD'S WORD® Translation)
  • They will be priests of God and the Messiah, and will rule with him for a thousand years. (International Standard Version)

They will reign; rule and be kings with him, the Messiah for a thousand years. This is God’s purpose and why they are made unto God a kingdom of priest.

Will Christ reign, and where will his rule be?  1 Corinthians 15:25 says “he must reign”.  So, according to the scriptures, it a far-gone conclusion.

Why must Christ reign, why can’t Christ do as you believe, to spend one thousand years with Christ in heaven before returning to the new earth and a new life?

As you see, the plan of salvation is not finished, and will not be until this phase of the work is complete.

24Then the end will come (the end of Christ reign), when He (Christ) hands over the kingdom (what kingdom?) to God the Father after He has destroyed all dominion, authority, and power…

26The last enemy to be destroyed is death.…

Those who are resurrected first as a kingdom of priest will rule with Christ, they will help Christ destroy all dominion, authority, and power; THEY WILL ERADICATE SIN FROM THE EARTH.

This is why we are told in Revelation 5:10

Aramaic Bible in Plain English

“And you have made them a Kingdom, Priests and Kings to our God, and they shall reign over The Earth.”

Good News Translation

You have made them a kingdom of priests to serve our God, and they shall rule on earth."

The focal point is the earth because all dominion, authority, and power are in this world and now rule over it; not in heaven where God reign.

Next, I will explain why you are incorrect concerning the position of Adam, as you have said,

We will be restored to the position that Adam was in before the fall.

Some people would not believe even if the dead were raised in front of them by the living God. Good points Gene, right on!

The spirit of religion and or deceiving and or bondage spirits prevent people from receiving the truth of the Word of God even if explicitly and simply told or written before them.

The spirit of bondage and religion and deception is rampant in Christianity in general due to the apostasy and the Nicoladian doctrine. God showed me many years ago that the bondage spirit was very prevalent in a certain church which I will not mention so as not to offend. Many Christians have "spiritual problems" meaning they have spirits that affect them in certain areas of their physical, spiritual, family, financial or emotional life.

Who among Christianity or just SDA has the understanding, desire, experience, and ministry to deal with such spiritual matters? Where are they? Why is the Book of Acts not duplicated since that time? 

To you accusers and mockers: So you think you have the answers when you don't even consider the questions above. Go ahead, call me names and poke fun and call me Satanic, and ignore the state of the church in general as well as the SDA in particular. Close your eyes, a little sleep, a little slumber and soon Christ shall return and you shall have to give an account of why you sat content with the status quo and did not move with the spirit of God to deliver God's people from bondage, etc.

James said:

"God showed me many years ago that the bondage spirit was very prevalent in a certain church which I will not mention so as not to offend. Many Christians have "spiritual problems" meaning they have spirits that affect them in certain areas of their physical, spiritual, family, financial or emotional life."

You would not know the Holy Spirit is if it hit you on the nose just look at your Bible study efforts making the Mark of the beast a computer chip. Even a Knuckle dragger would be able to come up with a better answer.  The spirit of self-aggrandizement is the spirit of Satan. 

Reasoning,

I do agree that to be with Christ is to be in heaven, but where will Christ be?

Matthew 19:28

Jesus said to them, "Truly I tell you, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

What is the renewal of all things and when will it be?  Jesus says it will take place when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne. When will that be? Again, Jesus says in Matthew 25:31

But whenever The Son of Man comes in his glory and all his Holy Angels with him, then he will sit upon the throne of his glory.

You have a fairy-tale view of the second coming. As you believe Christ is coming back to take you and people like you to heaven where you can build mansion, go over books and whatever else your imagination can think of.  However, the bible gives us a true picture; Jesus is coming to take charge of this world.

Luke 22:29And I bestow on you a kingdom, just as My Father has bestowed one on Me, 30so that you may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom, and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

The Father has bestowed upon Jesus a kingdom.

He said therefore, A certain high-born man went to a distant country to receive for himself a kingdom and return.

Jesus will return to be king over all the earth, not to go back where he received the kingship, but to establish the kingdom upon his return.  Where do we see Christ returning back to heaven?

Gene said:

"You have a fairy-tale view of the second coming. As you believe Christ is coming back to take you and people like you to heaven where you can build mansion, go over books and whatever else your imagination can think of.  However, the bible gives us a true picture; Jesus is coming to take charge of this world."

The one who is having fairytales Gene is you because you have not reconciled all texts on the subject as I told you before "A text taken out of context is a Pretext"

Gene, I agree with your statement above regarding the fairy tale view of the second coming. They ignore the plain truth of the Millenium 1000 year reign of the Messiah on Earth because of doctrine they were taught which is incorrect.

They ignore the Book of Revelation, as well as Ezekiel and many other prophetic passages. I have provided Companion Bible Appendixes which provides information and diagrams of the City and the Sanctuary described in detail in reeds that is in the center of the City of Jerusalem. This is not the same as the first, second or yet to be built the third temple, but it will stand during the 1000 year reign of Christ wherein he will rule with a rod of iron and those nations that do not make offerings will not receive rain.

The doctrine that the whole earth will be unoccupied by humans is completely contrary to the scriptures. But if EGW or your pastor says it, who are you to question it. We should question and think and review what we believe often.

James, stick to drag your knuckles and your computer chip.

James said, "We should question and think and review what we believe often."

Absolutely. Otherwise one would end up just quoting Bullinger, for example, when it suits one and ignoring Bullinger when it doesn't. Much better to be able to explain for oneself what one believes by reference to the Bible. 

Peace 

 Gene wrote: "I do agree that to be with Christ is to be in heaven, but where will Christ be?"

  I agree, being anywhere with Jesus is to be in Heaven for sure. However, the Heaven I'm speaking of is where the Father's house is located. 

 Where is the Father's house with the rooms/mansions?

Do you believe the Father's house with the many rooms is coming down to earth from Heaven? 

 All I know that is where saints are going to be, how do I know ? Because the Bible says it. 

  

  John14: 2 In My Father’s house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you? 3And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and welcome you into My presence, so that you also may be where I am. 4You know the way to the place where I am going

 

  Can we agree the place being prepared for the saints is in the Father's house which is in Heaven? 

Blessings! 

Hi Reasoning (lost my place)

I know this is a lot, but I’m trying to explain what you’re not understanding.

Jesus and the Father is One, they have an eternal relationship. The Father’s house is heaven, Jesus said he was going there; The word of God speaks to that.

Moffatt New Testament (Acts 3:21)

who must be kept in heaven till the period of the great Restoration. Ages ago God spoke of this by the lips of his holy prophets;

Another bible calls it “the time for the universal reformation”.

He will forever be coupled and synced  to the Father and to the Father’s house, but the work the Father has ordained for the Messiah to accomplish during the period of the 1000 years will not be in the Father’s house; it will not be in the heavens of heaven, there’s no universal reformation which must take place there.

In Matthew 19:28 we read;

(ISV)

Jesus told them, "I tell all of you with certainty, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne in the renewed creation, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, governing the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 25:31 shares when this will be;

The Amp. Version bible says

Jesus said to them, Truly I say to you, in the new age [the Messianic rebirth of the world], when the Son of Man shall sit down on the throne of His glory, you who have [become My disciples, sided with My party and] followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones and judge the twelve tribes of Israel.

[The world will not end, the present evil age will.]

Most people may think that Jesus already sits on his throne, but Jesus tells us he now sits with the Father.

(Rev. 3:21) He who overcomes (is victorious), I will grant him to sit beside Me on My throne, as I Myself overcame (was victorious) and sat down beside My Father on His throne.

Jesus tells us when this will occur; when he will sit on his throne.

When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, He will sit on His glorious throne.

Jesus also said this in Luke 22:30

And as My Father has appointed a kingdom and conferred it on Me, so do I confer on you [the privilege and decree], The point is this: the throne of Jesus and the kingdom of Jesus is no is not the Father’s and will not be in the heavens of heaven to it will be heaven and of heaven.

That you may eat and drink at My table in My kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

So, when Jesus says, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

He did not say what we so easily assume, that our destination is to the Father’s house.

8 Philip said unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it suffice us. 9Jesus said unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that has seen me has seen the Father; and how say thou then, Show us the Father?

The glory of the Father is in the Son. God has made us a kingdom of priest through the Son.

Revelation 1:6 and has made us to be a kingdom and priests to serve his God and Father-to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen

The kingdom that Jesus will rule over for a thousand years is not the Father’s house in the heaven of heavens, but it will be kingdom that was bestowed upon Jesus; the kingdom of this world.

The seventh angel then blew [his] trumpet, and there were mighty voices in heaven, shouting, The dominion (kingdom, sovereignty, rule) of the world has now come into the possession and become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ (the Messiah), and He shall reign forever and ever (for the eternities of the eternities)!

The kingdom of this world is now ruled by the god of this world, everything we know is a mixture of good and evil.

So, when Jesus said, “that you may be where I am”, we must understand where Jesus will be during that time.

Amplified 1 Corinthians 15: 24-28

After that comes the end (the completion), when He delivers over the kingdom to God the Father after rendering inoperative and abolishing every [other] rule and every authority and power.

For [Christ] must be King and reign until He has put all [His] enemies under His feet.

For He [the Father] has put all things in subjection under His [Christ's] feet. But when it says, All things are put in subjection [under Him], it is evident that He [Himself] is excepted Who does the subjecting of all things to Him.

However, when everything is subjected to Him, then the Son Himself will also subject Himself to [the Father] Who put all things under Him, so that God may be all in all [be everything to everyone, supreme, the indwelling and controlling factor of life].

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