I was doing a study to write a outline of the foundational pillars of Adventism. Everyone seems to have a personal view of what they entail but limited support for it. What SOP or writings in church periodicals has everyone on this important issue as I have the following pillars.....
The investigative judgment
The sanctuary service
The perpetuity of the Law of God
The faith of Jesus
The Three Angels' Messages
The seventh-day Sabbath
The state of the dead
The special gift of prophecy (or the Testimony of Jesus).
You can lead a horse to the water but you can not make it drink.
The SOP is very important to many, I was hoping to see something of EGW where she really unlocks the scriptures on this topic.
The question for me as it relates to the Pillars is where and how did EGW obtained her conclusions? Did it come by special revelation or in-depth study of the bible text? If the latter then we should be able to follow as she expounds upon the scriptures.
Her claim is that the Spirit is the third person of the Godhead, and as Jason has put forth “evidence” of what is believe the identity of the personhood of the Spirit.
Also, JohnB mentioned the and made the following statement:
“Ellen White refers to "the truths upon which the people of God have stood for the past fifty years" and, by virtue of chronology, this must include the truth of the Holy Spirit being the third Person of the Godhead which had been established over the previous decade and specifically her statement in regard to "the heavenly trio".”
He also wrote, “In 1906 she wrote, "The Holy Spirit has a personality, else He could not bear witness to our spirits and with our spirits that we are the children of God. He must be a divine person, else He could not search out the secrets which lie hidden in the mind of God."”
How does these things make the Holy Spirit a person? Does she clarify this by the scriptures or does she just conclude these of her own reasoning?
I have pointed out several things, 1 Timothy 2:5 says
“For God is One, and The Mediator of God and the sons of men is One: The Son of Man, Yeshua The Messiah…”
No mention of a third person. Also, I point to 1 Corinthians 8:6
To us, ours is one God The Father, for all things are from him and we are in him, and The One LORD JEHOVAH Yeshua The Messiah, for all things are by him, and we are also in his hand.
Here again, God The Father, for all things are from him and we are in him, and The One LORD JEHOVAH Yeshua The Messiah. Again, trio of powers making up the Godhead these texts pointing to the Godhead itself.
As for your comment, you best make sure you’re drinking the right water; mister horse.
If we can show in the Bible the Three great Powers together, would you then accept this doctrine?
Yes, the Living Water is the right water and it seems to me you are not drinking from that steam. And now you want to see posts from EGW writings that you have rejected before, really?
Just to mention that the HOLY SPIRIT appears over 19400 times in EGW writings so it is clearly a subject she was well acquainted with.
The question for me isn’t so much if they are mentioned; indeed, they are. The question is, what is he nature of the Holy Spirit? I believe that the Spirit itself is God, not as another God person, but the manifestation of the One God and Father. Genesis 1 for example:
1In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2Now the earth was formless and void, and darkness was over the surface of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters. 3And God said, “Let there be light,” and there was light.…
The Spirit of God moved as God spoke, showing it is the active power of God’s word. It is clearly the manifestation of God in action, which is not another God, but verily God.
So, it not that I don’t believe the Holy Spirit, I don’t believe it to be a third God being, but please show me the scriptures you have in mind and let God show us or me this issue in full. But let it be known, like you I also once believe the Trinity, but it was something I was taught as a custom.
The HOLY SPIRIT appears over 19400 times in EGW writings.
If this is the case, certainly we should be able to find something where she truly opened up and expounded upon the scriptures in concluding the Holy Spirit is a person.
Ok fair enough but before we get into other scriptures let's apply some logic.
Can God be in heaven speaking things into existence while His Spirit is someplace else hovering over stuff?
Can God do anything without His Spirit? For example His Spirit in Africa but He is in heaven speaking to Jesus?
In other words can God and His Spirit be active in different projects at the same ?
Can Jesus be in a river being baptized and the Holy Spirit be in the form of a dove and God in heaven saying this is my Son in whom I am well pleased?
God has form, but God is not limited to space and time because the Spirit is God; God is omnipresence by His Spirit. So, to answer your question, yes. God in heaven acts by His own Spirit.
A person on earth can be in one place and that person’s image and voice can be broadcast to another place, and we’re not even speaking of holographic projection technology.
ok, good. Can we worship His Spirit since He is God or should we only Worship God but not His Spirit?
Indeed Gene happy hunting for the 19400 items.
Gene quoted Gen.1:1-3
In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (Gen 1:1-3)
Note: verse 1: God; verse 2: Spirit of God; verse 3: "God said", the Word of God or Jesus.
The first 3 verses give you the three persons of the Godhead.
Now I know that Gene has a problem with this but in an illogical way as he has already accepted the Father and the Spirit in another thread so it is really just a question of accepting that Emmanuel really was "God with us" rather than denying the name. Instead of repeating the same questions that have been answered before - read what SoP says for yourself and explain how the Spirit of God is not God. Gene has previously accepted the logic that, in as much as Gene's spirit is Gene and not someone else or an impersonal power, so God's Spirit cannot be anyone or thing other than God.
However, there are plenty of threads in which both Gene and James have argued their positions but this thread is about the Pillars of the SDA faith. Neither Gene nor James have replied on topic, nor added anything to the subject of the thread.
So, to reiterate, it doesn't matter one jot what either of you think about the Godhead as it is irrelevant to the topic. James is not even an SDA, just someone who has pushed himself into this forum with his own agenda and insists on trying to force his own false doctrines into every thread with no respect for anyone. I note also that James has completely ignored challenges to his false history and just repeats his error. There is no desire to learn or discuss.
So, why not respond in in threads that already exist instead of infecting this thread?