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Who are the "true" davidians, are they the shepherds rod or ???

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Peace 

Jason wrote: " I thought we were clean on what the "the harvest of the world" meant? why do we have to go over this again?"

Because you don't answer questions, I addressed this already. Right, let me explain again. 

EGW: "The tares and the wheat are to grow together until the harvest; and the harvest is the end of probationary time. – COL 71


Jason you are confusing "until the harvest " and the harvest is the "end of the world" to mean when Jesus comes and all eyes can see Him... That's when you think the separation will happen. I agree that's when Jesus comes for His harvest to go to Heaven, but the separation takes place right before the harvest/Loud Cry. 

 But EGW is very specific, she says the tares and the wheat are to grow together until the harvest, and she says specifically the harvest is the "end of probationary time"....

  Ok, our question should be, when is the end of probationary time?


The SDA teaching is that the end of probationary time is right after the end of the harvest for the world and before the last plagues start.. it's not when Jesus comes in the clouds.  

 When the last plagues start, this is too is considered the "end of the world",  But it's not the literal end of the world when Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him. 


Your thinking and teaching has tares in the Church until Jesus comes in the clouds, when in fact there won't be any tares in the Church during the time of harvest of the great multitude, the Loud Cry. So, no tares in the Church at the beginning, middle or end of the harvest/end of probationary time.

  Let consider what your teaching brother Jason, in a nutshell, your teaching that tares will be in GOD'S Church during the Loud Cry. That the tares and  wheat mingle together during the Loud Cry like they do today. 

 Another question you refuse to answer that shows tares must be removed before the Church gives the Loud Cry is about the shaken that must take place in the SDA Church. My question, what do you think the purpose is of the shaken that's to take place in the SDA Church?

 I thought the SDA teaching is that the shaken is to shake out those who don't belong in the SDA Church. What say you?

Blessings! 

you said:

" Your thinking and teaching has tares in the Church until Jesus comes in the clouds, when in fact there won't be any tares in the Church during the time of harvest of the great multitude, the Loud Cry. So, no tares in the Church at the beginning, middle or end of the harvest/end of probationary time.

ok, please provide the quotes to substantiate these assumptions: 

1.  there won't be any tares in the Church during the time of harvest

2. that 'the harvest' is a harvest of the great multitude 

3.the explanation, backed by quotes and text, of  the loud cry

we are going in circles here. The bible and SOP is saying one thing but you are saying something different. you are denying the bible and SOP to hold on to your assumptions and false beliefs. there is no point in this. 

Peace 

Jason wrote: you said:


" Your thinking and teaching has tares in the Church until Jesus comes in the clouds, when in fact there won't be any tares in the Church during the time of harvest of the great multitude, the Loud Cry. So, no tares in the Church at the beginning, middle or end of the harvest/end of probationary time. "


Jason wrote: "ok, please provide the quotes to substantiate these assumptions: "


Jason wrote: "1. there won't be any tares in the Church during the time of harvest"

Sure, but you must put on your reasoning cap,

 Let's understand what your advocating, your teaching there will be tares in the Church during the harvest/Loud Cry/Latter rain. 

Here's the proof the tares/weeds won't be in GOD'S Church.. first, the question you've been avoiding, what do you think the purpose of the shaking is for the SDA Church? 

 It's two fold, it's to shake out the tares and purify the saints of GOD.

EGW : "I asked the meaning of the shaking I had seen and was shown that it would be caused by the straight testimony called forth by the counsel of the True Witness to the Laodiceans. This will have its effect upon the heart of the receiver, and will lead him to exalt the standard and pour forth the straight truth. Some will not bear this straight testimony. They will rise up against it, and this is what will cause a shaking among God’s people. – {EW 270.2}
I saw that the testimony of the True Witness has not been half heeded. The solemn testimony upon which the destiny of the church hangs has been lightly esteemed, if not entirely disregarded. This testimony must work deep repentance; all who truly receive it will obey it and be purified. – {EW 270.3}

  

  Let's check this statement out,


EGW: "During the Loud Cry the CHURCH, aided by the providential interpositions of her exaled Lord, will diffuse the knowledge of salvation so abundantly that light will be commmunicated to every city and town." Ev 694 [1904]

 Putting on our reasoning cap, do you believe GOD is aiding tares by His providential interposition? In other words, do you believe HE is going to use tares to give the Loud Cry? 

 The wheat are the only ones to give the Loud Cry. 

 EGW: The third angel’s message is swelling into a loud cry, and you must not feel at liberty to neglect the present duty, and still entertain the idea that at some future time you will be the recipients of great blessing, when without any effort on your part a wonderful revival will take place.... Today you are to have your vessel purified, that it may be ready for the heavenly dew, ready for the showers of the latter rain; for the latter rain will come, and the blessing of God will fill every soul that is purified from every defilement. It is our work today to yield our souls to Christ, that we may be fitted for the time of refreshing from the presence of the Lord—fitted for the baptism of the Holy Spirit.... – {Ev 701.4}

EGW : "Not All Will Receive the Latter Rain
I was shown that if God’s people make no efforts on their part, but wait for the refreshing to come upon them and remove their wrongs and correct their errors; if they depend upon that to cleanse them from filthiness of the flesh and spirit, and fit them to engage in the loud cry of the third angel, they will be found wanting."Testimonies For The Church 1:619 (1867). – {LDE 195.1}

 Those who are found wanting won't be engaging in giving the Loud Cry. If a person is found wanting, then that means they are tares, and they aren't apart of GOD'S Church giving the Loud Cry. 

Let's go back,

EGW: "During the Loud Cry the CHURCH, aided by the providential interpositions of her exaled Lord, will diffuse the knowledge of salvation so abundantly that light will be commmunicated to every city and town." Ev 694 [1904]

 Who are those considered to be the Church? With the quotes I provided, it's clear, the Church during the Loud Cry is the wheat and only the wheat. 

The tares won't be mingled with the wheat during the Loud Cry 

EGW: "Not condemnation and judgment of others, but humility and distrust of self is the teaching of Christ’s parable. Not all that is sown in the field is good grain. The fact that men are in the church does not prove them Christians. The tares closely resembled the wheat while the blades were green; but when the field was white to the harvest, the worthless weeds bore no likeness to the wheat that bowed under the weight of its full, ripe heads. Sinners who make a pretension of piety mingle for a time with the true followers of Christ, and the semblance of Christianity is calculated to deceive many; but in the harvest of the world, there will be no likeness between good and evil. Then those who have joined the church, but have not joined Christ, will be manifest. {Lt86-1907.13}

".. when the field was white to the harvest,.." & "..In the harvest of the world,.." Is a particular time, again , it's the time of the Loud Cry/Latter rain, the time of the great ingathering of the great multitude of saints in the fallen churches and the world. 

 During this time the weeds bore no likeness to the wheat, they won't be mingled together during or in the harvest of the world.  

Jason wrote: "2. that 'the harvest' is a harvest of the great multitude"

 

 I know "the harvest" only means to you as the literal end of the world, the time Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him... I agree Jesus is coming for His harvest of living righteous saints and harvest of dead righteous saints.. However, the harvest is a particular time, it's before the close probationary time, during the Loud Cry/Latter rain. 

EGW: "The latter rain, ripening earth’s harvest, represents the spiritual grace that prepares the church for the coming of the Son of man. But unless the former rain has fallen, there will be no life; the green blade will not spring up. Unless the early showers have done their work, the latter rain can bring no seed to perfection." Testimonies to Ministers and Gospel Workers, 506 (1897). – LDE 183

 EGW: "As the “former rain” was given, in the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at the opening of the gospel, to cause the upspringing of the precious seed, so the “latter rain” will be given at its close for the ripening of the harvest. “Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the Lord: His going forth is prepared as the morning; and He shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.” Hosea 6:3. “Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the Lord your God: for He hath given you the former rain moderately, and He will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain.” Joel 2:23. “In the last days, saith God, I will pour out of My Spirit upon all flesh.” “And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.” Acts 2:17, 21. – GC 611

 This harvest spoken of is the harvest of the great multitude to come out of the fallen churches and the world.

 Do you accept this proof that the harvest is the time of the Latter rain/Loud Cry, the time of the harvest of the great multitude from the fallen churches and the world? 

Jason wrote: "3.the explanation, backed by quotes and text, of the loud cry
we are going in circles here. The bible and SOP is saying one thing but you are saying something different. you are denying the bible and SOP to hold on to your assumptions and false beliefs. there is no point in this.""

  Actually brother Jason, it is you that is going in circles, I'm in the same place with the Bible and SOP. 

Blessings!

Peace


I know this post is about the Davidians, but really it's about what is the SDA teaching is on particular subjects. Now, in regards to the subject of the tares and the wheat in the Church, I laid out why the SDA teaching is that the tares won't be mingled with the wheat, during the time of the Loud Cry/Latter rain.


This should be great news to some, and dreadful news to others, but let's focus on the great news... No tares in GOD'S Church during the Loud Cry. Yea....!!!! 

This should be good news, but unfortunately, because the Davidians teach this message as well, it's being treated as a false message.


The rebut to this teaching, mainly by Benicio and Jason here on AO is that tares will be in the Church all the way up until the time of Jesus' coming when all eyes can see Him.

That is not true. Why are you guys teaching untruthful things? It appears it's because the Davidians teach this as well.


  Many in the SDA Church teach that when the last plagues start there won't be any mingling of tares and wheat, one of the two sides will be chosen, and GOD'S people will go through the last plagues together to meet Jesus in the air. This is something being taught right now in Sabbath school from the quarterly on page 85.

So why is it being taught that tares and wheat will be mingled together through the plagues till Jesus come?

 It appears to be because the Davidians teach this, they teach a full separation of the tares and wheat happens just before the Loud Cry. I'm thinking when VTH highlighted this fact from the Bible and SOP, the rebut from some SDA back then was that tares and wheat will be mingled together until the end, and the end is when Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him, and that's been built on ever since, that's my thinking, and I'm assuming That's why brother Jason and Benicio keep posting the quote from EGW

 

"The wheat and tares grow together until the harvest, the end of the world."

 If a SDA takes this quote to mean tares will be mixed with the wheat until the time Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him, then they are wrong. The quarterly on page 85 says "People have already made their choice either for GOD or for Babylon"... this before the plagues start. To go back further, the Latter rain only falls on the wheat, there won't be no resemblance with the tares at that time.

 I take each Bible subject and study it and investgate it by the Bible, I did that with EGW writings coming into the SDA faith, for me, it's proven her writings are inspired by GOD, and it helps us understand the Bible more clearly. But I say this to say, I don't care where a teaching comes from, I just study it, and investigate it with the Bible and SOP. 

 In studying the subjects the Davidians teach, Benicio and Jason has been on a smear campaign against me, calling me a lair, being down with Satan, etc... just because I find agreement in particular subjects. But Its fine with me, I thank GOD and stay focused on the subject. 

 In staying focused, there is overwhelming proof that the weeds will be removed from the wheat just before the Loud Cry/Latter rain, which means the SDA Church will go through a shaken and be purified, the main ones left in the Church, the wheat to go out to give the Loud Cry.

 Another touchy subject and question is, will it be only 144,000 that will remain after the shaking in the SDA Church? For me, I will not touch that, I will just pray that all in SDA Church will see the truth and be on one accord and take part in giving the Loud Cry. But we do know for sure it'll be 144,000, a group SOP says we should strive to be amongst. 

 Blessings!

 so inspiration tells us that " The tares and the wheat are to grow together until the harvest; and the harvest is the end of probationary time." {COL 71.3}, and that "the wheat and tares grow together until the harvest, the end of the world" SO we see here that the end of probationary time is the end of the world. 

furthermore she stated on many occasions that the seven last plagues will be poured out after the close of probation: 

The nations are now getting angry, but when our High Priest has finished His work in the sanctuary, He will stand up, put on the garments of vengeance, and then the seven last plagues will be poured out. {CET 100.2}

"...but when the seven last plagues shall be poured out without mixture into the cup of His indignation, then it will be forever too late to repent and find shelter. No atoning blood will then wash away the stains of sin. {CCh 333.4}

I was shown that the seven last plagues will be poured out after Jesus leaves the sanctuary. {EW 52.1}

you said "So why is it being taught that tares and wheat will be mingled together through the plagues till Jesus come?" 

who have said this here? please provide the evidence

I saw that many were neglecting the preparation so needful and were looking to the time of “refreshing” and the “latter rain” to fit them to stand in the day of the Lord and to live in His sight. Oh, how many I saw in the time of trouble without a shelter! They had neglected the needful preparation; therefore they could not receive the refreshing that all must have to fit them to live in the sight of a holy God. Those who refuse to be hewed by the prophets and fail to purify their souls in obeying the whole truth, and who are willing to believe that their condition is far better than it really is, will come up to the time of the falling of the plagues, and then see that they needed to be hewed and squared for the building. But there will be no time then to do it and no Mediator to plead their cause before the Father. Before this time the awfully solemn declaration has gone forth, “He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.” I saw that none could share the “refreshing” unless they obtain the victory over every besetment, over pride, selfishness, love of the world, and over every wrong word and action. We should, therefore, be drawing nearer and nearer to the Lord and be earnestly seeking that preparation necessary to enable us to stand in the battle in the day of the Lord. Let all remember that God is holy and that none but holy beings can ever dwell in His presence. {EW 71.2}

Peace

Jason wrote: "so inspiration tells us that " The tares and the wheat are to grow together until the harvest; and the harvest is the end of probationary time." {COL 71.3}, and that "the wheat and tares grow together until the harvest, the end of the world" SO we see here that the end of probationary time is the end of the world.
furthermore she stated on many occasions that the seven last plagues will be poured out after the close of probation: "

 

 Ok cool, you believe the tares and the wheat aren't mingled together when the last plagues begin?

 If so, we agree, however I'm asking you to go back during the time of the Latter rain, when the Loud Cry is given.. SOP teaches that's the time the Church won't be mingled with tares, that there won't be any resemblance. 

EGW : The tares closely resembled the wheat while the blades were green; but when the field was white for the harvest, the worthless weeds bore no likeness to the wheat that bowed under the weight of its full, ripe heads. Sinners who make a pretension of piety mingle for a time with the true followers of Christ, and the semblance of Christianity is calculated to deceive many; but in the harvest of the world there will be no likeness between good and evil. Then those who have joined the church, but who have not joined Christ, will be manifest. – COL 74.3

"In the harvest for the world there won't be likeness between good and evil"...
This is before the last plagues start and the time Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him.. During the harvest or "in the harvest " which is the Loud Cry, there won't be mingling between sinners and saints.

 Can we agree?

It seems like we agree that the end of the world spans a period of time, however I think we can agree the absolute end of the world is when Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him. 


Jason wrote: "you said "So why is it being taught that tares and wheat will be mingled together through the plagues till Jesus come?"  who have said this here? please provide the evidence"

 This is who said it "here",

Benicio wrote: "She says that the wheat and tares will grow together until
the harvest, the end of the world. And she says at the time of
harvest ye (meaning Christ) shall return and discern which places
the harvest at Christ’s second coming
."

This is who said it officially in regards to what SDA Church is teaching, 

BRI: " Houteff also interpreted the parable of wheat and tares and the harvest of Revelation (Matt. 13:36-43; Rev. 14:14-19). These he applied to the present time period, anticipating the coming of the Davidic kingdom. Instead of describing events to occur at Jesus' return, Houteff believed the harvest of grain began January 1, 1931, with a vision he received appointing him to call out the 144,000. The harvest of tares, he taught, will be a divine slaughter of Adventists who reject his message, fulfilling the prophecy of Ezekiel 9."

BRI wrote : "Yet Jesus clearly assigns the harvest and the separation of grain from tares to His return at the end of the world, which follows the close of probation (Matt. 13:39-43)."

 I'm not sure what VTH taught in regards to 1931, but what I'm pointing out to you is that people in SDA Church (BRI) teach the separation of tares and wheat happens at Jesus' return.... "At" His return is after the last plagues. 

 Now that I have a clearer view of what you believe, you believe the separation happens at the close of probation, the time the last plagues start, the quarterly appears to teach the same thing.

 However, the SOP teaches that when the Latter rain falls, there won't be any resemblance of the wheat and the tares. They won't be mingled together.

 

 EGW : "....  the semblance of Christianity is calculated to deceive many; but in the harvest of the world there will be no likeness between good and evil. Then those who have joined the church, but who have not joined Christ, will be manifest. – COL 74.3

 SOP says "in the harvest", in other words, during the time of the harvest of the world there will be no likeness between good and evil. The harvest is before the last plagues brother Jason. So all you need to do is come back further to when the separation actually takes place. If you can do that then we can finally start agreeing on some things and try to move forward to being on one accord. 

 

 I know the Davidians teach the same thing in regards to the separation of the wheat and tares, but please, don't let that cloud your vision on what the SOP actually teach. 

GOD Bless you and your family my brother! 

When the seven last plagues start probation is already closed.

 

You said: ““In the harvest for the world there won't be likeness between good and evil"..

 

But Ellen white said …”in the harvest of the world”

Then you falsely concluded on your misquote: “This is before the last plagues start and the time Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him.. During the harvest or "in the harvest " which is the Loud Cry, there won't be mingling between sinners and saints.”

 

How can I agree with falsehood?

 

It was impossible for the plagues to be poured out while Jesus officiated in the sanctuary; but as His work there is finished, and His intercession closes, there is nothing to stay the wrath of God, and it breaks with fury upon the shelterless head of the guilty sinner, who has slighted salvation and hated reproof. In that fearful time, after the close of Jesus’ mediation, the saints were living in the sight of a holy God without an intercessor. Every case was decided, every jewel numbered. Jesus tarried a moment in the outer apartment of the heavenly sanctuary, and the sins which had been confessed while He was in the most holy place were placed upon Satan, the originator of sin, who must suffer their punishment. {EW 280.2}

 

Many of the wicked were greatly enraged as they suffered the effects of the plagues. {EW 282.1}

 

The wheat and tares “grow together until the harvest.” In the discharge of life's duties the righteous will to the last be brought in contact with the ungodly. The children of light are scattered among the children of darkness, that the contrast may be seen by all.—Testimonies for the Church 5:100 (1882).

The Lord is coming in power and great glory. It will then be His work to make a complete separation between the righteous and the wicked. But the oil cannot then be transferred to the vessels of those who have it not. Then shall be fulfilled the words of Christ, “Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.” The righteous and the wicked are to be associated together in the work of life. But the Lord reads the character. He discerns who are obedient children, who respect and love His commandments.—Testimonies to Ministers and Gospel Workers, 234 (1895)

 

You then said: “ SOP says "in the harvest", in other words, during the time of the harvest of the world there will be no likeness between good and evil. The harvest is before the last plagues brother Jason. So all you need to do is come back further to when the separation actually takes place. If you can do that then we can finally start agreeing on some things and try to move forward to being on one accord.”

 

 

Brother this thing is so clear I am at a lost why you are still confused on this

 

 

 

Peace 

Jason wrote: "When the seven last plagues start probation is already closed."

 I agree with that... What would make you believe I said otherwise? Is there something I said to make you believe that? If so, please provide the evidence. 

Jason wrote: "You said: ““In the harvest for the world there won't be likeness between good and evil"..

But Ellen white said …”in the harvest of the world”
Then you falsely concluded on your misquote: “This is before the last plagues start and the time Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him.. During the harvest or "in the harvest " which is the Loud Cry, there won't be mingling between sinners and saints.  How can I agree with falsehood?"

If your not fully understanding what I'm saying then it would cause you to think what I'm saying is falsehood. 

 First, where did I misquote EGW? Where is your evidence?

 I see I wrote "for" and EGW said "of".... Is that what your talking about? If so, how does that change anything? 

Next, when EGW says "in the harvest of the world ", when do you believe this time is? 

 I believe it's during the time of the Loud Cry.. that is the time of the harvest of the world. What say you? 

 Blessings! 

Peace 

Jason wrote: "Brother this thing is so clear I am at a lost why you are still confused on this"

 But it's you who's confused... Your right, it is so clear.. Let me explain what I'm saying to you in the clearest way possible. 

 GOD'S Church/people/the wheat during the Latter rain/Loud Cry will not have tares mingled together with them.  I think that is very clear. This is what the SOP teaches. 

Just think for a moment, you believe tares, who Satan planted in the Church to deceive, you think they will remain in the Church during the Loud Cry? 

EGW: The Latter Rain and the Loud Cry
"The angel who unites with the third angel is to lighten the whole earth with his glory. The first angel’s message was carried to every mission station in the world, and in some countries there was the greatest religious interest witnessed since the Reformation. But these are to be exceeded by the last warning of the third angel.  HF 371
The work will be similar to that of the Day of Pentecost. The “former rain” was given at the opening of the gospel to cause the upspringing of the precious seed; so the “latter rain” will be given at its close for the ripening of the harvest. Hosea 6:3; Joel 2:23. The great work of the gospel is not to close with less manifestation of the power of God than marked its opening. The prophecies which were fulfilled in the outpouring of the former rain at the opening of the gospel are again to be fulfilled in the latter rain at its close. Here are “the times of refreshing” to which the apostle Peter looked forward. Acts 3:19, 20.  HF 372
Servants of God, their faces shining with holy consecration, will hasten from place to place to proclaim the message from heaven. Miracles will be wrought, the sick will be healed. Satan also works with lying wonders, even bringing down fire from heaven. Revelation 13:13. Thus the inhabitants of the earth will be brought to take their stand. " HF 372

 Again, SOP teaches that when the Loud Cry takes place, the servants of GOD, HIS Church will be free of tares. 

 Right now, you believe this separation of the tares in GOD'S Church takes place at the close of probation, the time the last plagues start. That is not true.. I mean your right in saying there will be a separation at that point, but the separation didn't happen then, it happened right before the Loud Cry. 

EGW : The tares closely resembled the wheat while the blades were green; but when the field was white for the harvest, the worthless weeds bore no likeness to the wheat that bowed under the weight of its full, ripe heads. Sinners who make a pretension of piety mingle for a time with the true followers of Christ, and the semblance of Christianity is calculated to deceive many; but in the harvest of the world there will be no likeness between good and evil. Then those who have joined the church, but who have not joined Christ, will be manifest. – COL 74.3

"In the harvest of the world " is the same time as the Latter rain/Loud Cry. Tares won't be mingled with the wheat.  

  Can we finally agree on what the SOP teaches my brother? 

 Blessings!

As the members of the body of Christ approach the period of their last conflict, "the time of Jacob's trouble," they will grow up into Christ, and will partake largely of His spirit. As the third message swells to a loud cry, and as great power and glory attend the closing work, the faithful people of God will partake of that glory. It is the latter rain which revives and strengthens them to pass through the time of trouble. Their faces will shine with the glory of that light which attends the third angel. (1T 353)

At that time the "'latter rain," or refreshing from the presence of the Lord, will come, to give power to the loud voice of the third angel, and prepare the saints to stand in the period when the seven last plagues shall be poured out. (EW 86)

Those who come up to every point, and stand every test, and overcome, be the price what it may, have heeded the counsel of the Tree Witness, and they will receive the latter rain, and thus be fitted for translation. (1T 187)

"The time of test is just upon us, for the loud cry of the third angel has already begun in the revelation of the righteousness of Christ, the sin-pardoning Redeemer. This is the beginning of the light of the angel whose glory shall fill the whole earth." {RH, November 22, 1892 par. 7}

"Let us, with contrite hearts, pray most earnestly that now, in the time of the latter rain, the showers of grace may fall upon us. At every meeting we attend, our prayers should ascend that at this very time, God will impart warmth and moisture to our souls. As we seek God for the Holy Spirit, it will work in us meekness, humbleness of mind, a conscious dependence upon God for the perfecting latter rain." {RH, March 2, 1897 par. 7}

Peace 

Beautiful statements brother Jason, but it doesn't goes against anything I've been saying. Again, this is a post about the Davidians and what they teach, there are some things I disagree with, and some things I agree with...

 

 One of things I agree with is that the tares will be removed from GOD'S Church right before the Loud Cry. That a shaking will take place in the SDA Church to remove them. That's one of the things Davidians teach. 

 You teach the separation doesn't take place till the end of the harvest, which is the close of probation. Again, we agree there will be a separation at that time, but the separation will take place right before the Loud Cry. 

 Another teaching I agree with is that the 144,000 will not be the only righteous saints alive when Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him.

 The Biblical SDA teaching is that there will a great multitude gathered during the Loud Cry, and they will stand on GOD'S side to go through the last plagues together with the 144,000, and all of them gets translated to meet Jesus in the air. 

 Pastor Doug B. from amazing facts believes and teach this in his book 'Who will sing song.. Understanding the 144,000'. 

 There is a teaching within the SDA Church, and if I'm not mistaken brother Jason you believe the same...  the belief that only 144,000 righteous saints will be  alive when Jesus comes in the clouds when all eyes can see Him. 

 The quarterly seems to imply this as well... But it's important that it's just one teaching... One clear teaching!

 If it's said well... There are different views on thees subjects and the actual truth is not certain, then I say the devil is a lair. GOD is not the author of confusion. 

Blessings! 

 

Benicio check the similarities 
Upon the crystal sea before the throne, that sea of glass as it were mingled with fire,—so resplendent is it with the glory of God,—are gathered the company that have “gotten the victory over the beast, and over his image, and over his mark, and over the number of his name.” With the Lamb upon Mount Zion, “having the harps of God,” they stand, the hundred and forty and four thousand that were redeemed from among men; and there is heard, as the sound of many waters, and as the sound of a great thunder, “the voice of harpers harping with their harps.” And they sing “a new song” before the throne, a song which no man can learn save the hundred and forty and four thousand. It is the song of Moses and the Lamb—a song of deliverance. None but the hundred and forty-four thousand can learn that song; for it is the song of their experience—an experience such as no other company have ever had. “These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth.” These, having been translated from the earth, from among the living, are counted as “the first fruits unto God and to the Lamb.” Revelation 15:2, 3; 14:1-5. “These are they which came out of great tribulation;” they have passed through the time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation; they have endured the anguish of the time of Jacob’s trouble; they have stood without an intercessor through the final outpouring of God’s judgments. But they have been delivered, for they have “washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.” “In their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault” before God. “Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple: and He that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.” They have seen theearth wasted with famine and pestilence, the sun having power to scorch men with great heat, and they themselves have endured suffering, hunger, and thirst. But “they shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.” Revelation 7:14-17. {GC 648.3}
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In all ages the Saviour’s chosen have been educated and disciplined in the school of trial. They walked in narrow paths on earth; they were purified in the furnace of affliction. For Jesus’ sake they endured opposition, hatred, calumny. They followed Him through conflicts sore; they endured self-denial and experienced bitter disappointments. By their own painful experience they learned the evil of sin, its power, its guilt, its woe; and they look upon it with abhorrence. A sense of the infinite sacrifice made for its cure humbles them in their own sight and fills their hearts with gratitude and praise which those who have never fallen cannot appreciate. They love much because they have been forgiven much. Having been partakers of Christ’s sufferings, they are fitted to be partakers with Him of His glory. {GC 649.1}
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The heirs of God have come from garrets, from hovels, from dungeons, from scaffolds, from mountains, from deserts, from the caves of the earth, from the caverns of the sea. On earth they were “destitute, afflicted, tormented.” Millions went down to the grave loaded with infamy because they steadfastly refused to yield to the deceptive claims of Satan. By human tribunals they were adjudged the vilest of criminals. But now “God is judge Himself.” Psalm 50:6. Now the decisions of earth are reversed. “The rebuke of His people shall He take away.” Isaiah 25:8. “They shall call them, The holy people, The redeemed of the Lord.” He hath appointed “to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness.” Isaiah 62:12; 61:3. They are no longer feeble, afflicted, scattered, and oppressed. Henceforth they are to be ever with the Lord. They stand before the throne clad in richer robes than the most honored of the earth have ever worn. They are crowned with diadems more glorious than were ever placed upon the brow of earthly monarchs. The days of pain and weeping are forever ended. The King of glory has wiped the tears from all faces; every cause of grief has been removed. Amid the waving of palm branches they pour forth a song of praise, clear, sweet, and harmonious; every voice takes up the strain, until the anthem swells through the vaults of heaven: “Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.” And all the inhabitants of heaven respond in the ascription: “Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honor, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever.” Revelation 7:10, 12. {GC 650.1}
Revelation 7 
13. Then one of the elders asked me, “These in white robes—who are they, and where did they come from?”
14... And he said, “These are they who have come out of the great tribulation; they have washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 
15. 
“they are before the throne of God
    and serve him day and night in his temple;
and he who sits on the throne
    will shelter them with his presence.
16 ‘Never again will they hunger;
    never again will they thirst.
The sun will not beat down on them,[a]
    nor any scorching heat.
17 For the Lamb at the center of the throne
    will be their shepherd;
he will lead them to springs of living water.’[b]
    ‘And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes
Now compare with {GC 648.3}
None but the hundred and forty-four thousand can learn that song; for it is the song of their experience—an experience such as no other company have ever had. “These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever He goeth.” These, having been translated from the earth, from among the living, are counted as “the first fruits unto God and to the Lamb.” Revelation 15:2, 314:1-5. “These are they which came out of great tribulation;” they have passed through the time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation; they have endured the anguish of the time of Jacob’s trouble; they have stood without an intercessor through the final outpouring of God’s judgments. But they have been delivered, for they have “washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.” “In their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault” before God. “Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple: and He that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them.” They have seen the earth wasted with famine and pestilencethe sun having power to scorch men with great heat, and they themselves have endured suffering, hunger, and thirst. But “they shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.” Revelation 7:14-17. {GC 648.3}

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