Should women preach, become elders, pastors, leaders?
When all is said and done the only two testimony's that matter are the Bible and SOP, so I don't know why you took to binging these men in to it in the fist place, because no one to my knowledge even referenced them.. So what is your point in bringing them in to all of this?
And if you are going to bring any he said she said in to it, you should be ok with providing a quote.. He has written several books and sermons that are available for free on line, so if he said it, then you should be able to give at least one quote...
"O soul, are you weary and troubled?" Yes mine is troubled with concern for you as I observe you evasive maneuvering in the light of intellectual honesty..
You can take the martyrs position all you want. You can endlessly repeat this "spoiled child" act all you want. However, even if you misuse this beautiful hymn endlessly, you have not shown that ordaining anyone who will is according to God's will.
All you are demonstrating is that what you want to believe is of more importance then what the Bibel says. It is this behavior that brought Clark to the point of shutting down this forum. You claim that you want the forum to stay open, yet you are perpitrating the very activity that brought it to the brink.
Are you trying to get it shut down, contrary to what you claim? Please, stop desecrating a beautiful hymn, just to paint yourself as some tortured martyr, becasue you refuse to accept what is stated in God's word.
That was honest, clear and well spoken. We need more of that here..
very true Ray, we should speak the truth in love
Eph 4:15 '..speaking the truth in love, may grow up into Him in all things, which is the Head, even Christ..."
I have come to learn and appreciate that if we are to gain from the word of God, we are to unlearn our ways and beliefs and ask God to show us the way. If we read the scripture with an 'i-know-what-this-means' attitude, then we miss the mark and cannot get the truth even when the TRUTH IS UNDERLINED.
it is very sad to see such an attitude in a bible discussion, it even makes it hard to follow the discussion.
So now the conversation has run down to one person repeating over and over again, something that has NOTHING to do with the question at hand..
Nice try there, Kristina, trying to get her to actrually SAY something..And now there is more than one thing she is reposting..
If opinion is allowed, for that is all I have, I shall offer it up..
Personally, as a woman, I am usually unimpressed with womens preaching. And heres why..
I LOVE a good testimony, and it doesnt matter who it is as long as the testimony has a foundtion on the moving of the Holy Spirit. When God moves, I am interested..
But for a woman, tp preach full time, puts her in a position of a man of authority. Thats just true.
Heres where I will probably get bombarded.... Women would be happier, men would be happier, if women were at home, WHERE THE HEART IS, caring for the ones who reside there.. Of course men, would have to be Godly and be converted by the Holy Spirit and have the ability to love as Christ loves..
THIS IS PERFECTION in God's eyes, in a way.. HE created family.. He ordained the act of marriage before sin came into the world.. It MUST be perfect..
This covers more than one topic, as I begin to see it.. But I will not go off topic..
But, if we are striving to live up to Gods vision for our lives, and that vision HAS a written form, the Bible, then we can know that it includes a simple and familial home base.. Based on His example, GIVEN in the garden..
Being a minister is full time, and many women these days are willing to do that. Abandon the perfect example for thier own desires. Based on the offerings of the world.. Womens Lib, for example..
I AM a woman.. And I would LOVE to find that relationship! But, alas, this IS the end of the DEgeneration.. I messed up, and so did so many good SDA boys and men..
The perfect relationship may be ever elusive on planet dark, the human perfection of a good family may NOT be attainable to all.. Does that mean we allow our hurt or anger, or whatever EMOTION that results, to overthrow the VERY IDEA OF that perfect relationship? To make us ridicule that relationship for others? Or just to allow us to be able to see the Bible FROM our new and wounded perspective?
I have had the WORST of relationships... BAR NONE... And still I can see that Gods Way is best.. Just because I was robbed of it (by myself?) doesnt mean the perfection of Gods idea of family is flawed.. Doesnt mean I go and look for reasons to let the Bible fit my pain.. Instead of going to the Bible for Gods mercy and love, we go to the Bible to wrest things from it so that we can make war with others..
When we will HAVE to engage in war with others,and we must do it quietly with only an " I can do no other", may God bless us, may our cause be true, and not based on what the world has done to us..
Hi Deborah - can i ask who you are talking about here - when you say the person is repeating.... thanks. just need to know. it sure is not me. i dont believe i am doing anything wrong
Its not you, Irene.. :) If you look back over the last couple pages, you will see..
She is talking about Teresa.
thanks. I didnt really think so but wasnt sure since reply was made right after my comment. thanks Deborah and Kristina!