What are the processes that leads to disfellowshipping a church member, and what will disfellowshipping solve at the end? Does the church have a monitoring tool for the disfellowshipped to keep them close lest they leave forever?
Desmond Ford rejected one of our fundamental beliefs, a doctrine that has been clearly laid out by our prophet. He made a statement of faith at his baptism, which he then renounced.
I am not referring to clearly defined biblical doctrine, I am referring to when Christ brings understanding to things that have been forgotten, when He brings new light, no man has the right to tell someone else they must believe or not believe, it must be down to the individual, no one has the right to force the conscience.
And if you are going to tell me that the leadership are walking with God and would be able to discern these things, then you are reading a different Bible, and are definately not reading the councils in the SOP.
For instance, a pastor locally here a few weeks ago told his congregation that it is no longer salvational to believe the 2300 days. Yet he is not being disfellowshiped.
Are you going to tell that he is responsible for leading people into all light?
What about womens ordination? What about overcoming sin? The leaders have no idea.
I could go on and on, yet you want people to believe that we are to put our trust in man for our salvation?
Show me biblically where you have that right?
Don't you understand about guilt by association? You see even if it would not be you doing such a thing, the fact that you agree with it makes you a participant.
As for not being one of you, I am not quite sure what that means.
Although I am a baptised member of the SDA Church, that doesn't mean that I agree with everything the structure says. I am accountable alone to God for my words and actions, and will stand by what the Word of God says over mankind any day, Jesus is my God, not the structure.
Ronald my friend, that is entirely up to you.
It seems however that whenever I ask you to account for your statements, you just decide you don't wish to discuss it anymore.
If you are not prepared, or cannot back up from scripture what you are saying, may I suggest you refrain from making such statements?
I have another question.
What kinds of things have people been disfellowshipped for? Or seen others disfellowhshipped for? Or threatened with disfellowshipment?
So far we have:
- Becoming pregnant (but not causing a pregnancy)
- Holding a Revelation seminar without an Elder
- Holding to different theology (Firm Foundation or Shepherd's Rod beliefs)
I am just interested in finding out what kinds of things are considered offences worthy of disfellowshipment in various SDA churches, since individual churches have so much discretion in this area.
@Real. This is not a failure of the non-attending, ratther it is a failure of the Pator and Elders. Had either the Pastor or the Elders performed their duties these folks would not have been wiped off and forgotten. It is a lapse in Christian duty. I wonder how many of these remained in the Church after being treated so sinfully? For my part, I was a Co-Leader of a group. I became so ill, that I could have died. Rather, than care or concern, when I was restored to my health and went to perform my duties I was slandered, lied above, removed from position, and even had people come to my home to insult me to my face. These were supposed to be fellow Adventists. Now, I know how Job felt. But, I did not find the backdoor and leave the church, I left that church group to be certain and beat the dust off my sandals. Now, when I am well, or my son is well, we travel 60 miles to the nearest Adventist church. However, when a pastor found out how horribly I had been treated he feared I would leave the church. I told him, not to worry, what other Church could I attend that was as sound in doctrine as Adventism?
However, I fear for my other brothers and sisters who have been so abused and mishandled that it may have cost them and caused them to wander without a church and to become Atheists. It is not an easy thing. But, I didn't care what wicked people thought of me. I cared more for what God thinks of me.
This is not a failure of the non-attending, rather it is a failure of the Pastor and Elders. Had either the Pastor or the Elders performed their duties these folks would not have been wiped off and forgotten. It is a lapse in Christian duty. I wonder how many of these remained in the Church after being treated so sinfully?
You BEAT ME to this response by 3 1/2 minutes! PASTORS AND ELDERS WHO ACTUALLY CARE ABOUT THE SHEEP ARE NEEDED!
However, I fear for my other brothers and sisters who have been so abused and mishandled that it may have cost them and caused them to wander without a church and to become Atheists. It is not an easy thing.
“Woe to the shepherds (pastors) who destroy and scatter the sheep of My pasture!” says the Lord. Therefore thus says the Lord God of Israel against the shepherds who feed My people: “You have scattered My flock, driven them away, and not attended to them. Behold, I will attend to you for the evil of your doings,” says the Lord. “But I will gather the remnant of My flock out of all countries where I have driven them, and bring them back to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase."--Jeremiah 23:1-3. (NKJV)
Very true we need good shepherds not wolves!
Works of the flesh and adherance to SDA dogma without question is the standard sought, with no regard to actually walking with God by the spirit. In fact no one is taught how to really walk by the spirit, and in fact it is not allowed in the assemblies. There is a marked absense of the spirit of God working to any great degree. There is no manifestations with few exceptions such as discerning of spirits though rare, and once in a blue moon someone may have inspiration, but the spirit is quenced to the highest degree in fear, ignorance, and superstition, by unbelief and peer pressure.
God forgive them of their unbelief. God loves to deliver His people, but unbelief hinders it.
Smoking does generally not interfere with the operation of the gift of God. I saw many signs, miracles and wonders as a believer thst smoked a pack a day for many years, as well as seeing God work in others who smoked and in those that did not smoke. Religion puts restrictions and conditions in place supposing that man can set rules that decide whether God will work or not? All the religions do so. Salvation comes by believing, not by works of the flesh, but only by grace. Same also with the walk with God, it is by grace.
It appears so far that the SDA dogma and complete opposition to any manifestations of holy spirit whatsoever, with no prophesy, tongues or its interpretation, or healing or any of the 9 manifestations in operation has maintained a church organization dead to the lively and active spirit of God, as seen in the Book of Acts. Waiting for the latter rain is a false excuse because Joel was fulfilled in Acts as stated and referred to by Peter on the Day of Pentecost.
That most all SDA seem to be content without God manifesting by faith in the body speaks volumes. Christ in you is trying to manifest and do great works and wonders, but can't because of lack of desire, faith, knowledge, wisdom, experience and understanding. The contentment is astounding, particularly with the end times and world events. Verily, the will of God is greatly frustrated. How the zeal of the wicked puts to shame the church even though the wicked work is evil, they are not afraid to manifest their evil for their god. It is a shame and a witness of great contentment in complacency.
No one is forcing you to be here, we dislike you satan driven miracles that is obvious to most that you are a false prophet and a braggart to boot. And guess what you have not gained one convert to your satanic driven religion, one wonders why?