Adventist Online

Muslims are very hard to get people,why?because they are very allergy of the words Bible and Jesus,even the doctors of theology couldn't win their hearts thru bible study,Qur'an study or whatsoever,but God said,you can win their hearts thru love,i have something to share you,but it is only a part of our approach here in tawi-tawi,Philippines www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&hl=en-GB&client=mv-google&v... if you have yours pls. share it alsö here...

Views: 958

Replies are closed for this discussion.

Replies to This Discussion

We as SDA's are one of the only churches they will have peace with, because.

 

1.) We do not eat unclean meats which they consider an abomination.

2.) We keep the Saturday Sabbath.

3.) One of their own spiritual leaders made an announcement after listening to some of the Spirit filled men of the church 

"They are here! These are the people of the book that are to come near the end!" Even in their own book and their own spiritual leaders we are acknowledged as God's last day people. There religion may be twisted up in many ways, but as with most some truth peaks though the vail and many are accepting truth based on this.

 

I will have to get back to you later on the name of the leader.. It is spoken of in this testimony though it you want to listen for it. "Testimony of a Former Illuminati Mark Cleminson"

Do not be fooled that they are our friends because the Qu'ran teaches that you are not suppose to be a friend of Christians and that you should kill every "infidel" that does not hold true to the teaching of the Qu'ran. The only christian movement that they will be friends with are the Catholics. Did you not ever wonder why is there a catholic church almost beside every Muslim Mosque. I have a video to show that the hypocrisy of Muslim.If you are on facebook visit the Wendy Sands profile there you will see a video that was uploaded.

They don't consider us Christians.. Their own words.. Though don't get me wrong I would think it foolish to consider it safe.. I have a copy of the Qu'ran at home.. My husband and I flipped to a random page and found a spot where it was saying you should cut someones head off...

 

Ya, Walter Vieth's work on it called "The Muslim Connection" is really informative...

Is that the one you are referring to?

I won't get hung up about the violence in the Quran. Most muslims have moved on beyond the "violent requirements" of the Quran just like many Christians have moved on beyond the requirement to stone Sabbath breakers and the call to kill every man, woman and child in some of the cities invaded by Israel.

@Bevan

I agree whole heatedly on that one.. I just think it safer to minister to them here in the U.S. where it is safer, due to the lack of extremest...

It would be wonderful if they could listen to own gospel without trying to kill us or anything. Yes we are supposed to preach the gospel in the whole world. But the Bible also tells us that we have to be as wise as serpents so you have to be careful of the "friends" you keep because you cant be friends with a persons unless you both agree or else compromise Bible truth so if  they and the catholica are friends ( dnt get me wrong there are good persons that will be saved in the catholic church) that means they agree or someone is compromising.

Did you know that the muslim organisation was started by the Catholic Church? bet you didnt know that? Muhammed wive was a catholic and she and her cousin helped muhammed to start the movement I have a video that proves it.

Perhaps you really should post the video. Many have made the claim but no proof has been adduced beyond Alberto Rivera's claims - and he provided no evidence beyond "because I said so."

 

Beyond the lack of evidence for that claim it should not be used (as it often seems to be) as an excuse not to engage with Muslims. We are possibly the only denomination that can effectively engage with Muslims and we have a church department which has been actively doing exactly. The results of that work has been more and more Muslims accepting that we really are '"the people of the Book" (أهل الكتاب‎).

Here is a link to the video I am pretty sure barbie was referring to.

 

http://amazingdiscoveries.tv/media/129/216-the-islamic-connection/

 

It is called The Islamic Connection by Walter Vieth, and actually has an exhaustive amount of historical evidence, and well as present day to prove the case.

 

You are right about one thing though.. We are the only ones that can reach them, and they do have more respect for us than any other denomination, because despite the false doctrines propagated by the Jesuit order some truth always manages to slip in... In this case the truth about God's end time church.

Thanks for the link.

 

Unfortunately, there is no source given for the information.

 

Veith says that, "she came from a Roman Catholic convent, so we could say she was a Roman Catholic nun. She was super-rich, she lived in a convent" but gives no sources for his statements.

 

He makes four distinct points: she was Roman Catholic; she was a nun; she lived in a convent; she was super-rich.

However, in "Khadija tul Kubra: A Short Story of Her Life" Syed A.A Razwy writes the following, "He bought gifts for Khadija, and took his brothers, Abbas and Hamza, with him to her house to formally present to her the proposal of the marriage of his nephew with her."

In her book "Essential Islam" Diane Morgan refers to Mohamed and Khadija meeting for the first time "on the balcony of Khadijah’s mansion".

 

Her riches came from her previous marriage to a wealthy merchant, Seyyed Hossein Nasr refers to Khadija as "a wealthy businesswoman and widow" ("Islam, History and Civilization"p.49). Some sources say that she was married twice before she met Mohamed. All seem to agree that she lived in luxury in her own house, not in a convent. Her father died when she was c.19 years old and she inherited his business and wealth, so it is hard to see when she would have been a "Roman Catholic" nun. 

 

As to her religion, we are told that she was "hanif" (not worshipping idols) and "Muwahhid" (monotheist) (ibid., Razwy). However, these terms do not mean that she was Catholic, in fact the use of the word hanif means that she was not Catholic.

 

Contrary to what you have said above, I note that Veith gives very little evidence for what he says in relation to Khadija, in fact he does not quote one primary source. I deeply suspect that all he is doing here is regurgitating what Alberto Rivera related to Jack Chick and was published in "The Prophet" comic.

 

[I have also noted that Veith gets a few points wrong about the religion itself, not the least being to claim that Islam is an exclusive religion that one cannot join!?]

If you read the book Total Onslaught I believe it states the source.

I'm looking for the book, in the meantime I have gone through Veith's lecture notes.

In his lecture outline for "Islamic Connection" Veith refers to a website - "Jahtruth". You can see this website referred to at the bottom of the slide that Veith has onscreen when he makes his statements. What he quotes from the site is, "Mohammed married Khadija, who was a Roman Catholic, when he was 25 and she was 40. Her cousin was called Waraquah and was also a Roman Catholic Meccan."

This quote is spread around the internet with no primary source quoted anywhere. In fact, most of the time the sites are quoting Veith. However, on lifelinetonac.com (which also has Veith's video embedded) it quotes Alberto Rivera's The Prophet and says, “History records that Khadijah was an adherent to the Hanif religion, which was monotheistic and claimed its roots back to Abraham via Ishmael, the son of Hagar. However, Khadijah was also closely related to family members who were Roman Catholic, most notably Khadijah’s cousin Waraqah b. Naufal.” No sources are given other than Rivera’s account.

 

Now, ignoring for the moment that Rivera was a fraud, does the limited historical record agree?

One particular quality in Khadija was quite interesting, probably more so than any of her other qualities mentioned above: she, unlike her people, never believed in nor worshipped idols. There was a very small number of Christians and Jews in Mecca, and a fairly large number of Jews in Medina. Waraqah ibn Nawfal, one of Khadija's cousins, had embraced Christianity and was a pious monk who believed in the Unity of the Almighty, just as all early Christians did, that is, before the concept of the Trinity crept into the Christian faith, widening the theological differences among the believers in Christ (as). He reportedly had translated the Bible from Hebrew into Arabic.”

(Khadija, Daughter of Khuwaylid, Wife of Prophet Muhammad, Yasin T. al-Jibouri)

She set out with the Prophet (Peace be upon him) to her cousin Waraqa bin Nawfal bin Asad bin ‘Abd Al-‘Uzza, who had embraced Christianity in the pre-Islamic period, and used to write the Bible in Hebrew.”

(Ar-Raheeq Al-Makhtum (The Sealed Nectar) by Saifur Rahman al-Mubarakpuri p.32)

"… But the country was not altogether devoid of individuals who found idolatry repugnant. These individuals, who were very few in number, were called "Hanifs," i.e., men and women "who had turned away from idol worship." Makka also had a sprinkling of these "hanifs," and some of them were in the clan of Khadija herself. One of them was her first cousin, Waraqa bin Naufal.

… Waraqa despised them for their polytheism and their moral turpitude. He himself followed the religion of Prophet Ibrahim, the true and faithful slave of Allah. He never associated any partners) with Allah. He did not drink and he did not gamble. And he was generous to the poor and the needy.

… Waraqa was one of the very few people in Makka who were educated. He is reported to have translated the Bible from Hebrew into Arabic. He had also read other books written by the Jewish and Christian theologians. 

… Khadija was strongly influenced by the ideas of Waraqa, and she shared his contempt for the idols and the idolaters. She did not associate any partners) with the Creator. Like Waraqa and some other members of the family, she too was a follower of the prophets Ibrahim and Ismael. Khadija was a Muwahhid (monotheist)!"

(Khadija tul Kubra : A Short Story of Her Life (Chap.2) by Syed A.A Razwy)

 

There are many Hadiths that support this, here are three:

Khadija then accompanied him to her cousin Waraqa bin Naufal bin Asad bin 'Abdul 'Uzza, who, during the PreIslamic Period became a Christian and used to write the writing with Hebrew letters. He would write from the Gospel in Hebrew as much as Allah wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight.”

(Sahih Bukhari Book 1 Hadith 3 narrated by ‘Aisha)

The Prophet returned to Khadija while his heart was beating rapidly. She took him to Waraqa bin Naufal who was a Christian convert and used to read the Gospels in Arabic…

(Sahih Bukhari Book 55 Hadith 605 narrated by ‘Aisha)

Khadija then took him to Waraqa bin Naufil, the son of Khadija's paternal uncle. Waraqa had been converted to Christianity in the Pre-lslamic Period and used to write Arabic and write of the Gospel in Arabic as much as Allah wished him to write. He was an old man and had lost his eyesight.”

(Sahih Bukhari Book 60 Hadith 478 narrated by ‘Aisha) (See also Book 87 Hadith 111)

 

Living under the Sassanid Persians (who were at war with the remains of the Roman Empire) it is rather doubtful that Christianity as practiced in the Western Empire would be embraced. In all likelihood Waraqah was either a Nestorian or an Ebionite. Both denominations were monotheistic and were described by the Catholics as being "judaizers", which was a coded way of saying that they were seventh-day Sabbath keepers.

Lastly, Abu Bekr, one of the Companions and the first of the four "righteous" Caliphs made a speech before he sent out the Islamic armies in which he admonished them to protect Sabbath-keeping Christians and to kill Catholic monks. Part of his speech is quoted in Rev.9.

I can find no evidence anywhere that suggests that Waraqah or Khadijah were Catholic, let alone Roman Catholic. No primary source(s) just Rivera and Veith making the claims without any proof. In fact, I suspect that Veith is paraphrasing Rivera without realising that Rivera was a fraudster.

You can by the book at amazingdiscoveries.com. That is where my husband got his.

RSS

Site Sponsors

 

Adventist Single?
Meet other Single
Adventists here:
Join Free


USA members:

Support AO by
using this link:
Amazon.com

 

© 2022   Created by Clark P.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service