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  If you are saying that self supporting simply means selling books or selling veggies then you miss half of the picture. You are sounding like many that I come across that have a beef with the  churches asking for money anywhere any time.  There is no deception here. They are simply asking for assistance financially.

These ministries that you have a problem with  do sell literature and raise funds other ways. They also give a goodly amount away free. If you do not wish to be a part of that you need not be. It seems to me that there are plenty of  real problems going on to take issue with , those of which that you do not so much as mention, that you need not throw stones as ministries seeking assistance.  If you choose not to help, I hope you are helping somewhere where the strait message is being preached.

It has already been explained that what is typically meant by self supporting is that ministries like AF do not draw from the mainline church funds. In that sense they are self supporting. You are straining gnats and letting the camels run free. 

"If you are saying..."

No, I'm not. I've said exactly what I was saying. No, ifs, buts or maybe's I've told you where I have a problem. If you want to continue to ignore what I am saying, put other motives on me or in any other way reinterpret what I have said... up to you. I have clearly stated that I have a problem with using such a story as a platform for fund-raising. You choose to interpret that as me being against AF, being against raising money for God's work, etc., rather than just accepting what I've written.


I prefer Muller's example and that has always been my preferred method of fundraising. As I said, I have used it myself - and it works. I have met a few others who have proved that method to be very effective. Muller used to raise the modern-day equivalent of $100 million. However, for those who do not believe in praying about these things there are always other methods.


So, to clarify for the very last time - I object to this important "Urgent Prophecy Alert" apparently being used as a springboard to ask for money. Any other motive that you want to put on me is a product of your imagination and your presumption as to the motives of others.

self supporting is whom can afford to use the money anymore cox is too much and so decide to start a ministry cox is already a billionaire! 

Yes John! also.. there are nothing that you need to be self support! If u are a theologian U MUST work under church ruler and rules! also to avoid gossip and scandal or to avoid being asking all time to explain why you are separated if you arent not disharmonious!? 99% of this kind of ministry just exist in NAD! 

Unfortunatelly NAD have good and bads example in everything and people love to copy them! also all USA culture pose as a model for good or for bad option! ita a trend to copy USA! doesnt matter is right or not! church and any not religious things too!  

Amazing Facts is not just self supporting, they are totally independent from the church.   They have no obligation to coordinate with the church in anyway, they can do whatever they want.

 The leaders at AF are all SDA church members so they are not working independant of the church. They are the church or at least  part of it.. If they were totally independent of the church they would not be invited to speak on 3ABN and to give evangelistic series in our churches. The fact that the mainline church cannot dictate and micro manage what happens there is a good thing. It tends to be a safe guard.

I am an SDA. I purchase my books from the mainline presses and from self supporting publishers. I am self supporting but not independent of the church. We must realize that the church that goes through is the faithful body that keeps the commandment and have the faith of Jesus rather than a group within the denomination that teaches Spiritual Formation and a host of other spiritualistic errors. 

I am very happy that AF is not under the thumb of the NAD given what I see happening here. Pretty soon some will claim that anyone who gives a Bible study or a Great Controversy away without approval from an official will be said to be working independent of the church. There are already some in leadership that do not want that book handed out. 

its very shameful if can decide all and do whatever they want....

What you said is technically correct in that Adventist funds do not go into Amazing Facts (other than Doug Batchelor's salary); but Amazing Facts does certainly consume some resources that would otherwise go to the Adventist Church.  If Amazing Facts did not exist all of their funding would not be delivered to the Adventist Church, but some of it certainly would be.  

Someone could argue the merits of giving money to Amazing Facts vs to the church, but there is no denying that more money to Amazing Facts is less money to the church.

Wow Shannon it looks like we have some gripe with Amazing Facts. I am  sure that the few dollars that the GC has outlaid to AF has been well and truly been rewarded with souls won for the Lord. What price is a soul Shannon? How do we know that those money given to AF would go to the GC? I know myself I have given money to AF that I would not have given to the church.  

Thank you for posting this video, Cindy.

Very interesting !

Yes Thanks for posting Cindy. I note here that some persons has a problem with fundraising. I believe you will find  that all independent ministries like Amazing Facts are self funded and their only way of staying in ministry is to ask for donations. It is up to us if we will donate to them. Judging by the way I have seen these Ministries grow over the years  I believe God is clearly behind the growth of these Ministries. 

For the Message we see here it is clearly a fulfillment of Prophecy and is worthy of being discussed as we see another piece falling in to place in the prophetic puzzle.   

wow; what about people coming to the door selling our literature? Evangelism takes money and it seems that God likes us to get involved with supporting it with our time, talents, and treasure.


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